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Category → Trade Idea

Would trading Greg Monroe and Rodney Stuckey for Arron Afflalo and Tobias help Detroit Pistons, Orlando Magic?

Chad Ford from his ESPN SportsNation chat on Dec. 30: 

(Orlando) probably should’ve traded him for Eric Bledsoe this summer when (they) had the chance. Now that’s the standard and I’m not sure there’s a better deal out there, despite the fact that Afflalo has been playing at an All-Star level all year. One deal I think would make sense — Greg Monroe and Rodney Stuckey for Arron Afflalo and Tobias Harris.

Interesting idea — and one that really doesn’t drastically favor either side — but it’s tough to envision a deal like that actually going down this season.

For one, reports have said they won’t be trading Stuckey, and it’s probably a smart bet that they’d only look to realistically move Monroe as a part of some sort of blockbuster deal today.

But, Ford’s right: Afflalo is in the midst of his most successful season as a pro. He”s actually looking eerily similar to the guy who starred on UCLA’s 2006 Final Four team.

He’d be a perfect fit for what this Pistons’ team desperately needs — shooting and perimeter defense with a little bit of playoff experience thrown in for good measure.

But the dilemma is deciphering whether this is simply just an impressive stretch or if Afflalo has actually turned the corner as a player. Orlando’s got a talented roster, but they’re also 10-games under .500, so is Afflalo just filling up the stat-sheet for a bad team?

Almost all of his numbers are at career-best levels, so that adds to those sustainability questions.

There’s a chance Afflalo could finally have blossomed into what some thought he was moving toward in Denver, but he could also be this year’s O.J. Mayo, sans a contract year.

Tobias Harris is a nice prospect who put together some very impressive games last season. I’ve got my doubts on whether he’s any better suited defensively to be a full-time small forward than Josh Smith, but he’s very well suited to do the job offensively.

Due to a number of injury issues, he’s gotten off to a slow start this season, so his value may have dipped a bit, but he’d still bring athleticism, rebounding and a much-needed shooter from deep to the Pistons.

As for the outgoing pieces, this is the kind of deal that makes some sense for the “Trade Greg Monroe” crowd. Monroe is a one-way player today, but trades and re-signings aren’t about the now. When you re-sign a young player, you’re valuing him for what he will bring to the table down the road — not what they’ll do tomorrow.

The big thing with this hypothetical is that Monroe is going to get better; that’s the logical step for a 23-year-old who’s improved steadily since he got into the NBA. Is Afflalo, 28, going to keep seeing this late-career boom as he enters his 30s?  He’s under contract until 2015-16, and he’s got a player option for $7.75 million that he’d likely accept in that final season.

Like Afflalo, Stuckey is probably playing the best ball of his career right now. That’s likely related to his impending free agency, but the combination of him playing well and having a big expiring contract may be attractive to Orlando if they decide that tanking is the way to go — even though they only trail the Pistons by 2.5 games for the final playoff seed in the East.

If you’re the Pistons and you’re not loving the future of the jumbo trio, this isn’t a bad deal at all. It’s a short term fix that doesn’t put the team in a horrible position going forward.

What do you think?

Would the Bulls trade Carlos Boozer for Rip Hamilton or Ben Gordon?

The Chicago Bulls need shooting guard help. The Pistons have extra shooting guards. Keith Langlois of Pistons.com posits on how the two teams would shape up as potential trading partners in his latest mailbag:

No question, the Bulls will need to target a shooting guard good enough to play starter’s minutes but particularly someone who can provide scoring – whether that’s a knock-down perimeter shooter or someone who can create off the dribble. It was widely reported that the Bulls were prepared to sign Rip Hamilton had he agreed to a buyout with Cleveland that would have allowed the reported Pistons-Cavs trade to go down at the trade deadline. It is already being speculated the Bulls will quietly but aggressively explore the trade market for Carlos Boozer this off-season. With Joakim Noah, Taj Gibson and Omer Asik, they have three players capable of manning the two inside spots. None is anywhere near the scorer Boozer has been. But Boozer is due about $60 million over the next four years – a whopping contract for a player who found himself mostly on the bench in the fourth quarters against Miami because he wasn’t offsetting subpar defense by providing consistent scoring, either in the paint or via his mid-range jumper. I think the Bulls would be naturally interested in Gordon, who enjoyed a high level of success there for five years. Their interest in Hamilton has been already evidenced. The Pistons could certainly use what Boozer at his best offers – but it would have to give them pause that an oft-injured player, about to turn 30, did not have the anticipated impact with the Bulls this season. It would be unusual, also, for teams in the same division with the history of the Pistons and Bulls to trade high-profile players.

A one-for-one Boozer-for-Hamilton trade works, but the Pistons would take on more salary both short and long term since Boozer makes more per year and is signed longer than Hamilton. A one-for-one Gordon-for-Boozer trade wouldn’t work salary-wise. But throw in Jason Maxiell? And you have the Pistons ridding two bad contracts for one bad contract, albeit to a player in Boozer who is sometimes useful and would fill a need as a sometimes capable offensive big man. The Pistons would take on more long-term salary in that deal, but it wouldn’t be as big a long-term hit as a Hamilton trade. If Chicago were willing to take both Gordon and Maxiell — a longshot to be sure, considering the Bulls could surely get better offers than that and no one knows if they are even that motivated to trade Boozer anyway — the Pistons would certainly be wise to consider. But I can’t say that I’d give a Hamilton for Boozer trade much consideration, considering Hamilton’s bad contract is only a year or so away from becoming an asset rather than an albatross. If Boozer’s production declines, a good bet considering his age and reputation for … uh … let’s just say relaxing a bit in non-contract years, his contract will become much more difficult to move down the road.

Chris Wilcox trade ideas

A year ago, the Pistons held a decently valuable trade chipKwame Brown. He was a serviceable big man on an affordable, expiring contract. At the time, it was already pretty clear he didn’t fit into the Pistons’ long-term plans, so there wouldn’t have been harm in dealing him.

The Pistons didn’t trade Brown and let him walk in the summer.

This year, they have another player in a similar situation – Chris Wilcox. Will Detroit take advantage this time?

Probably not, but let’s look at options, just in case.

The most obvious trade possibilities for Wilcox would be trading him for a better player who’s signed past this season. Detroit’s trading partner would get salary relief, and the Pistons would get talent. But because Karen Davidson is selling the Pistons, there’s basically no chance she’d approve a deal like that.

But that still leaves two types of teams who might have interest in Wilcox and could make an offer that would appease Davidson and Joe Dumars.

Contenders

Almost every team trying to advance in the playoffs this season could use an extra big man. You can never have enough. Wilcox would provide that without making a team commit to long-term salary.

A few ideas:

Long-term contract clearers

The Pistons could trade Wilcox and Jason Maxiell for a player making less than $8 million (the combined salary of Wilcox and Maxiell) and who’s more valuable than Maxiell, who has three years and $15 million remaining on his contract. If Karen Davidson is confident she can sell the team before next season, she might approve a trade like this. Such a deal would lower Davidson’s costs this year, but if she doesn’t sell the team, raise the payroll for future seasons.

The trading partner would save money after this season, when Wilcox expires.

A few possibilities:

Trade Idea: Taking on smaller bad contracts to move Rip Hamilton

This is trade-deadline week, so each day PistonPowered will bring you a trade-idea post. We’ll try to keep some parameters in mind — a realistic idea of the value of Pistons’ players to other teams, cost and the fact that the Pistons most likely can’t add short or long term salary with the team’s sale pending — and we fully encourage you to present your ideas in the comments.

Trade

Pistons trade:

Pistons receive:

  • Vince Carter
  • Hakim Warrick
  • Gani Lawal

Mavericks trade:

  • Caron Butler

Mavericks receive:

Suns trade:

  • Vince Carter
  • Hakim Warrick
  • Gani Lawal

Suns receive:

Salaries

Data from ShamSports.com

Pistons trade:

Player 2010-11 2011-12 2012-13 2013-14
Richard Hamilton $12,500,000 $12,500,000 $12,500,000 $0
Tayshaun Prince $11,148,760 $0 $0 $0
Tracy McGrady $854,389 $0 $0 $0
Total $24,503,149 $12,500,000 $12,500,000 $0

Pistons receive:

Player 2010-11 2011-12 2012-13 2013-14
Vince Carter
$17,522,375 $18,300,000 $0 $0
Hakim Warrick $4,250,000 $4,250,000 $4,250,000 $4,250,000
Gani Lawal
$473,604 $788,872 $0 $0
Total $22,245,979 $23,338,872 $4,250,000 $4,250,000

Mavericks trade:

Player 2010-11 2011-12 2012-13 2013-14
Caron Butler $10,561,960 $0 $0 $0
Total $21,769,246 $7,725,932 $8,396,364 $9,066,796

Mavericks receive:

Player 2010-11 2011-12 2012-13 2013-14
Richard Hamilton $12,500,000 $12,500,000 $12,500,000 $0
Tracy McGrady $854,389 $0 $0 $0
Total $26,648,760 $12,500,000 $12,500,000 $0

Suns trade:

Player 2010-11 2011-12 2012-13 2013-14
Vince Carter
$17,522,375 $18,300,000 $0 $0
Hakim Warrick $4,250,000 $4,250,000 $4,250,000 $4,250,000
Gani Lawal
$473,604 $788,872 $0 $0
Total $22,245,979 $23,338,872 $4,250,000 $4,250,000

Suns receive:

Player 2010-11 2011-12 2012-13 2013-14
Tayshaun Prince $11,148,760 $0 $0 $0
Caron Butler $10,561,960 $0 $0 $0
Total $21,710,720 $0 $0 $0
  • Early-termination option
  • Partially guaranteed

Pistons’ perspective

The best way to be rid of Hamilton’s contract is to accept a bad contract in return, but by including Prince and McGrady and their expiring deals in a bigger trade, the Pistons might be able to come up with a trade like this one that nets them a bad contract that is smaller, thus easier to move, than Hamilton’s.

I just picked Warrick randomly. The Suns have several players signed long-term at that salary range that could be plugged in — Channing Frye, Jared Dudley, Josh Childress to name a few. The Pistons win by getting Carter’s contract, which isn’t fully guaranteed next year, so the Pistons would save quite a bit in the long run by getting out of Hamilton’s deal. Plus they pick up a player I like a lot in Lawal.

Suns’ perspective

What the Suns get is quite obvious — immediate financial relief. They don’t have to pay Carter’s buyout because they get two deals in Prince and Butler who expire after this season. Plus, they’re the only team that may have more of a glut of price, one-dimensional wing players than the Pistons, so moving one of them is a bonus for the ones who remain on the roster past this season.

Mavericks perspective

The Mavs have higher hopes than Hamilton, namely Devin Harris. But if they fail to get the sought after Harris? Getting Hamilton and McGrady while only giving up the injured Butler would be a nice consolation prize.

Would the Mavericks and Celtics invest in the present to facilitate the Pistons trading Richard Hamilton and Tayshaun Prince?

This is trade-deadline week, so each day PistonPowered will bring you a trade-idea post. We’ll try to keep some parameters in mind — a realistic idea of the value of Pistons’ players to other teams, cost and the fact that the Pistons most likely can’t add short or long term salary with the team’s sale pending — and we fully encourage you to present your ideas in the comments.

Trade

Pistons trade:

Pistons receive:

  • Caron Butler
  • DeShawn Stevenson
  • Jermaine O’Neal

Mavericks trade:

  • Caron Butler
  • DeShawn Stevenson
  • Jermaine O’Neal

Mavericks receive:

Celtics trade:

  • Jermaine O’Neal

Celtics receive:

  • Shawn Marion

Salaries

Data from ShamSports.com

Pistons trade:

Player 2010-11 2011-12 2012-13 2013-14
Richard Hamilton $12,500,000 $12,500,000 $12,500,000 $0
Tayshaun Prince $11,148,760 $0 $0 $0
Chris Wilcox $3,000,000 $0 $0 $0
Total $26,648,760 $12,500,000 $12,500,000 $0

Pistons receive:

Player 2010-11 2011-12 2012-13 2013-14
Caron Butler $10,561,960 $0 $0 $0
DeShawn Stevenson $4,151,786 $0 $0 $0
Jermaine O’Neal $5,765,000 $6,226,200 $0 $0
Total $20,478,746 $6,226,200 $0 $0

Mavericks trade:

Player 2010-11 2011-12 2012-13 2013-14
Caron Butler $10,561,960 $0 $0 $0
Shawn Marion $7,055,500 $7,725,932 $8,396,364 $9,066,796
DeShawn Stevenson $4,151,786 $0 $0 $0
Total $21,769,246 $7,725,932 $8,396,364 $9,066,796

Mavericks receive:

Player 2010-11 2011-12 2012-13 2013-14
Richard Hamilton $12,500,000 $12,500,000 $12,500,000 $0
Tayshaun Prince $11,148,760 $0 $0 $0
Chris Wilcox $3,000,000 $0 $0 $0
Total $26,648,760 $12,500,000 $12,500,000 $0

Celtics trade:

Player 2010-11 2011-12 2012-13 2013-14
Jermaine O’Neal $5,765,000 $6,226,200 $0 $0
Total $5,765,000 $6,226,200 $0 $0

Celtics receive:

Player 2010-11 2011-12 2012-13 2013-14
Shawn Marion $7,055,500 $7,725,932 $8,396,364 $9,066,796
Total $7,055,500 $7,725,932 $8,396,364 $9,066,796
  • Early-termination option
  • Partially guaranteed

Pistons’ perspective

The Pistons obviously want to trade Richard Hamilton, and after Tayshaun Prince’s comments yesterday, they might want to trade him, too. This trade offers a fresh start, which the Pistons definitely need.

Ideally, the Pistons could acquire building-block assets while trading two of their better players of yesteryear, but that might be asking for too much. Clearing a couple malcontents from the roster, lowering next year’s payroll by $6,273,800 and acquiring the to-be-expiring contract of a veteran big man could be Detroit’s best-case scenario.

I think the Mavericks like Hamilton, but they don’t want to his contract (who does?). I think the Mavericks like Prince, and they’d take take him and his expiring contract in a heartbeat. Would getting Prince be enough to entice to Dallas to take Hamilton? Maybe. If not, I don’t see many other ways to lose Hamilton and his heavy contract.

The trade works without Chris Wilcox, whom the Pistons probably wouldn’t mind keeping or trading separately. But because the Mavericks play Shawn Marion a bit at power forward, which Prince has objected to doing in the past, Detroit would probably have to include Wilcox.

The Pistons could waive Butler and Stevenson, all but freeing them to re-sign with the Mavericks (unless a team claims them on waivers, which, given their salaries, appears unlikely). That move would likely save Karen Davidson a little extra money, and Detroit wants Butler and Stevenson only for their expiring contracts, anyway.

Once the team is sold and the Pistons can take long-term salary, Jermaine O’Neal’s expiring contract could help fetch a valuable piece this summer.

Mavericks’ perspective

Rob Mahoney of The Two Man Game:

This isn’t a bad trade for the Mavs by an means, and it would likely make them a better team in the short-term. That said, Dallas is currently on the cusp of contending, and has a lot to lose. Mark Cuban and Donnie Nelson have never been ones to shy away from big deals if they felt their team couldn’t cut it as is, but they seem genuinely confident that the Mavs — as assembled — can get it done. So even if this deal would be a technical improvement, it’s still rather unlikely from the Mavs’ perspective.

Regardless, there are some very interesting pieces here. Supposing that DeShawn Stevenson is waived and eventually finds his way back to the Mavs, Dallas loses very little. Trading Shawn Marion for Tayshaun Prince is essentially a lateral move, but one that gives the Mavs a better three-point shooter and likely saves the Mavs money over the long-term.

Those savings are hedged, of course, by the two full years remaining on Richard Hamilton’s deal. Cuban may be reluctant to add Hamilton if he, Donnie Nelson, and Rick Carlisle don’t view this trade as a significant upgrade. Given the money the Mavs committed to Dirk Nowitzki and Brendan Haywood last summer (in addition to the run they plan to make at re-signing Tyson Chandler), Cuban will be even more reluctant than usual to take on a contract like Hamilton’s. That’s not a deal-breaker in itself, but it’s another small red flag.

That said, the Mavs also would pick up a competent role player in Wilcox for relatively cheap while getting a substantial discount on Stevenson’s contract (should he sign with Dallas after being waived). Wilcox could fill in some of the minutes behind Nowitzki at power forward that were normally taken by Marion, and gives the Mavs an extra big to combat sizable contenders like the Lakers.

So essentially, Dallas would lose Shawn Marion and the right to re-sign Caron Butler in the off-season, and gain Richard Hamilton, Chris Wilcox, and a player comparable to Marion in Prince.

Hamilton is still a very useful player, and would look quite comfortable running around the baseline screens normally used to set up Jason Terry. Plus, having Jason Kidd orchestrating the offense and willing passers all around will only facilitate Hamilton’s scoring abilities.

There’s definitely enough here to make the Mavs think long and hard about completing this deal, but I’m just not sure it’s enough. Cuban, Nelson, and Carlisle like their team — any trade proposal that’s going to disrupt the established roster is going to have to knock their socks off, and this one doesn’t.
Plus, one last point to consider: Butler fits well in this Mavericks locker room, and he and his teammates genuinely seem to like each other. I don’t know that Dallas would shy away from trading him in general for chemistry reasons, but it’s worth noting that Butler is working very hard to rehab and return for the playoffs, and that fact isn’t lost on the Dallas brass.

I also sent Rob an alternate proposal. We agreed the Mavericks would probably rather keep Dominique Jones and take Chris Wilcox’s expiring deal than get Jermaine O’Neal. But the Mavericks showed interest in O’Neal this summer, so there’s a chance they’d prefer this alternate version. Rob breaks that down, too:

Dominique Jones wasn’t going to contribute in the immediate future anyway. Cuban may not be thrilled that the Mavs are trading away Jones – on whom Cuban spent $3 million to acquire on draft day — so quickly, but I don’t see Jones as the hang-up that would keep Dallas from making a deal like this one.

Jermaine O’Neal is pretty superfluous, honestly, but there’s nothing wrong with acquiring as many competent big men as possible in the hope that they might come in handy in a possible playoff series against the Lakers. If this deal were to go down, Dallas would have Chandler, Haywood, Ian Mahinmi, and Jermaine O’Neal as their center rotation, would could be the deepest set of 5s in the entire league.

Celtics’ perspective

Brendan Jackson of Celtics Hub:

Getting a strong perimeter defender and a solid rebounder for Jermaine O’Neal? Yes, please.

There is just one huge problem: this particular player, Shawn Marion, still has three years on his deal.

Danny Ainge has made it well known that he does not want any contracts that go beyond the 2012 season so the Celtics can go into full rebuild mode if necessary. Marion has a contract that would make him a Celtics for two years beyond that deadline. To make matters worse, he’ll be making over $9 million in the final year of his contract. If this were a month ago, I would have said this puts the definite kibosh on any deal for Marion. Now, with the indefinite nature of Marquis Daniels’ injury and the recent setback suffered by Delonte West, this deal deserves a second look.

Trade Idea: Would a Rip Hamilton for Andris Biedrins swap work for either team?

This is trade deadline week, so each day PistonPowered will bring you a trade idea post. Although we’ll try to keep some parameters in mind — a realist idea of the value of Pistons’ players to other teams, cost and the fact that the Pistons most likely can’t add short or long term salary with the team sale pending — we fully encourage you to bring on your half-baked and ill-conceived ideas in the comments.

Rip Hamilton has little trade value because of a poor contract, the fact that he’s now well into his 30s and his statistics that have declined for three straight years. If the Pistons move him, the most likely scenario involves them taking a bad contract back in return. I don’t see a Troy Murphy-style deal where Hamilton is miraculously moved for an expiring deal coming to fruition.

The Warriors have a bad contract tied up in an unproductive player in Andris Biedrins. Could a trade that flips one bad contract for another help either team?

Trade

Pistons receive:

  • Andris Biedrins
  • Charlie Bell

Warriors receive:

Salaries

Data from ShamSports.com

Pistons receive:

Player 2010/11 2011/12 2012/13 2013/14 2014/15
Andris Biedrins $9,000,000 $9,000,000 $9,000,000 $9,000,000 $0
Charlie Bell $4,447,792 $4.099,920 $0 $0 $0
Total $13,447,792 $13,099,920 $9,000,000 $9,000,000 $0

Warriors receive:

Player 2010/11 2011/12 2012/13 2013/14 2014/15
Rip Hamilton $12,500,000 $12,500,000 $12,500,000 $0 $0
DaJuan Summers $762,195 $1,059,293 $0 $0 $0
Total $13,262,195 $13,559,293 $12,500,000 $0 $0
  • Not fully guaranteed
  • Qualifying offer
  • Early termination

Pistons’ perspective

The Pistons have too many wing players. They have two wing players in Hamilton and Ben Gordon who are difficult to move because they are highly paid and signed long-term. Moving one of them for a big man, albeit a flawed one, along with Tayshaun Prince most likely leaving either via trade or free agency, thins things out on the wings, allows more playing time for Gordon and Austin Daye, as well as possibly opening up room to re-sign either Tracy McGrady or Rodney Stuckey and give them minutes off the ball and it gives the Pistons a still-young center in Biedrins who at one time was highly thought of enough that Golden State reportedly turned down the Pistons when they offered Chauncey Billups for him.

Plus, even though Biedrins has been terrible the last couple seasons, but there are still things to like about him:

But just two years ago, Biedrins averaged 11.9 points (on 57.8 percent shooting) and 11.2 rebounds in just 30 minutes per game. And he’s carrying a 1.2-blocked shot average for his career. Did we mention he’s still just 24?

At his best, Biedrins was an active, athletic big man who fought hard on the glass and came up with baskets without ever having a play called for him. At worst, he makes Ben Wallace look like Mark Price at the line.

As for Bell, he’s simply a throw-in in this deal, as much as my Flint connections want him to be more. He’s signed for one less year than Hamilton, so the Pistons save a little bit of money down the road, and Bell’s contract is reasonable enough where they could offer him a buyout if they don’t feel he’d be a good use of a roster spot.

Warriors Perspective

Similar to the Pistons, the Warriors would be simply swapping one bad, under-performing contact for another with the simple hope that Hamilton’s bad contract fits their needs better than Biedrins’.

The Warriors are said to be in the market for a bigger name small forward. Hamilton certainly isn’t the guy at the top of their list in all likelihood, but he’s a former All-Star, a player who led his team in scoring just last season and since he’s a big guard, he gives the Warriors more flexibility and size in the backcourt should they decide to deal Monta Ellis at some point. Trading Biedrins also opens up more time for Ekpe Udoh, who has the team excited about his contributions after missing much of the season due to injury.

Money-wise, Hamilton and Biedrins make nearly the same amount of money over the lives of their contracts, but Hamilton’s is for one less year than Biedrins, and the final year of Hamilton’s deal isn’t fully guaranteed, so conceivably, the Warriors could save a bit of money down the road by making the deal.

Conclusion

The Pistons likely aren’t going to find much interest in Hamilton. The Warriors are a young team that has played better lately, so who even knows if they are feeling any pressure to make a deal. And since the Pistons likely can’t take long-term salary, the Pistons would most assuredly need the Warriors to pay the difference in salaries this season, roughly around $200,000. Since the Warriors aren’t in the greatest financial shape either, I don’t know how likely it would be that they would acquiesce to that request.

But this is the type of deal that Pistons fans should expect in the unlikely event Hamilton is moved: one that involves another bad contract coming to Detroit. If it’s for a player like Biedrins, a bad contract who might fill a role better than Hamilton does, it might be worth considering. But outside of that type of exchange, I’m not sure there’s a suitable trade partner when it comes to Hamilton.

John Hollinger proposes the Pistons trade Richard Hamilton and Tayshaun Prince to the Clippers for Chris Kaman, more

ESPN’s John Hollinger came up with a few trade ideas today, including one involving the Pistons and Clippers. Let’s take a look.

Trade

Pistons receive:

Player 2010/2011 2011/2012 2012/2013
Chris Kaman $11,800,000 $12,700,000 $0
Randy Foye $4,250,000 $4,250,000 $0
Rasual Butler $2,400,000 $0 $0
Brian Cook $1,146,337 $1,265,976 $0
Total $19,596,337 $18,215,976 $0
  • First-round pick
  • $3 million cash

Clippers receive:

Player 2010/2011 2011/2012 2012/2013
Richard Hamilton $12,500,000 $12,500,000 $12,500,000
Tayshaun Prince $11,148,760 $0 $0
Terrico White $473,604 $788,872 $0
Total $24,122,364 $13,288,872 $12,500,000

-Player option

-Not fully guaranteed

John Hollinger’s explanation

This one seems too obvious not to pursue — Detroit offloads an unhappy camper and saves $12.5 million on the last year of the contract and adds a big man who hails from Michigan, while the Clippers get a potent sixth man for their rotation in return for a player who has become marginalized by DeAndre Jordan’s development. Several permutations of this deal work, especially if we involve a third team to take Jason Maxiell or Charlie Villanueva off the Pistons’ hands, but I’ve linked to a two-team deal that I like the best.

A straight-up Kaman-for-Hamilton deal is somewhat unfair in favor of the Pistons. But not dramatically so, and we can build off that. Send Tayshaun Prince to the Clippers and dangle a future first-round pick, Randy Foye and $3 million to pay Foye in front of Detroit and things even out. Obviously the key to this deal would be having Prince, an LA native, agree to an extension with the Clippers before the trade. The Pistons’ sale also shouldn’t be an impediment to this particular trade, as Detroit would send out more dollars than it takes back.

If the Clippers pulled this off, they’d immediately become a force in the West. The frontcourt would be thin, but with Prince filling the 3 and Hamilton coming off the bench, their top eight would be as good as anyone’s and they’d likely make a playoff run next season.

Verdict

I’d do it if I were the Pistons. Unfortunately, Breene Murphy of ClipperBlog didn’t find the deal as enticing:

I can’t imagine the Clippers would do this, considering all the money they would take on with the new CBA.

Am I crazy in thinking that Rip isn’t that good anymore? I mean, I’ve only seen a couple games of Detroit’s, but still.

And Kaman is at an all time low in terms of trade value. Why not wait and use him for better trades next year when his expiring contract and improved play can possibly draw a big time free agent that’s leaving?

I normally think that the Clippers overvalue Kaman, but the Clippers need a big more than a small forward, in my opinion. I think that Ryan Gomes rights himself to the extent he becomes serviceable and having Tayshaun on an extension blocks the possible development of Aminu. And while Tayshaun would be a monumental upgrade this year, I’m not sure it’s good for the future. And the Clippers are all about the future.

I guess I was just hopeful because someone unbiased thought the Pistons could make this trade.

Could Pistons trade Richard Hamilton to Lakers for Ron Artest and Luke Walton?

ESPN’s Marc Stein reported Ron Artest desires, at least in part, for the Lakers to trade him:

One source close to the situation insists that Ron Artest wants out.

Asked to react to that, Artest’s agent David Bauman declined comment.

This is where I’m obligated to remind you that no one in the NBA can change his mind faster than the famously fickle Ron-Ron.

I don’t think Artest will stick with this, but if he does, could that open the door for the Pistons to finally trade Richard Hamilton?

Trade

Pistons receive:

  • Ron Artest
  • Luke Walton

Lakers receive:

Salaries

Pistons receive:

Player 2010-11 2011-12 2012-13 2013-14
Ron Artest $6,322,320 $6,790,640 $7,258,960 $7,727,280
Luke Walton $5,260,000 $5,680,000 $5,800,000 $0
Total $11,582,320 $12,470,640 $13,058,960 $7,727,280
  • Early-termination option

Lakers receive:

Player 2010-11 2011-12 2012-13 2013-14
Richard Hamilton $12,500,000 $12,500,000 $12,500,000 $0
DaJuan Summers $762,195 $1,059,293 $0 $0
Total $13,262,195 $13,559,293 $12,500,000 $0
  • Qualifying offer

Salaries from ShamSports.com

Pistons’ perspective

The Pistons want to trade Richard Hamilton. There’s no doubt about that. He’s not helping the team or its image, and they’re paying him a lot of money to do neither.

This isn’t about assigning blame (although both sides deserve some). It’s about moving on.

The Pistons would save a small amount of money this year and next. That surely appeals to Karen Davidson, making this trade possible. After all, she has the final word.

Neither Ron Artest nor Luke Walton will fix the Pistons’ on-court problems, and both are overpaid. But it might be easier to regain financial flexibility with two medium-sized bad contracts rather than Hamilton’s large bad contract.

Of course, the elephant in the room is the brawl at The Palace, but I think we’re past it.

The Pistons showed interest in acquiring Artest a couple years ago, according to Sam Amick, then of the Sacramento Bee:

And from what I was told from one source close to the Pistons, they are. I’ve yet to get this info from more than one person, so stay tuned.

And for what it’s worth, Artest didn’t shoot down Detroit, according to The Detroit News (via Matt Watson of Detroit Bad Boys):

“I wouldn’t consider not playing here,” Artest said. “But right now I’m doing Sacramento. But it’s not something I’m opposed to, you know. That would be a hell of a first day if Ron Artest was in a Pistons’ jersey. That would be kind of crazy.”

I thought I heard Artest say – whether he meant it is another story – he wanted to sign with the Pistons in 2009, but they didn’t want  him. Does anyone have a link on that?

Anyway, Artest is probably over the hill, but maybe he could help the Pistons’ re-establish their defensive identity. Even if Artest can’t execute as well as he once could, this team badly needs more defensive intensity, and that could help Detroit’s impressionable and talented players like Austin Daye, Greg Monroe, Jonas Jerebko, Ben Gordon and Charlie Villanueva.

Lakers’ perspective

Any move the Lakers think about making begins with questioning how Kobe Bryant would react. Judging by this 2006 Chris Palmer article, Kobe would favor this trade:

The final buzzer sounds and Kobe wades through the flood of players, coaches, ballboys, and security personnel to find Rip Hamilton, coming toward him, unhitching the Velcro straps on his protective facemask. The two embrace for a long time, patting each other on the back, whispering congratulations and what’s ups. They step back, exchanging toothy grins, Hamilton’s left hand on Kobe’s shoulder, Kobe’s on the back of Hamilton’s head. Never have I seen Kobe so at ease, so openly friendly with an opponent. More shocking still is to see someone else so relaxed around him. Players from other teams are reluctant to fraternize with Kobe, largely because they assume he has no interest in friends. But Kobe wants to shed the loner tag, to be one of the guys. He wants to laugh and joke with his colleagues around the league. For him, though, it’s not that simple.

Except with Hamilton. With Hamilton, it’s easy.

Beatwriters who follow Kobe struggle to name players he counts as friends. They recall attempts to socialize with his teammates outside the walls of the Staples Center or the Lakers practice facility, but scarcely know of anyone who’s been to his home. He simply lives too far away.

Hamilton is the right fit for Kobe. His sunny disposition makes it easy for Kobe to be himself, even if he doesn’t yet know who that is. Kobe trusts him, refuses to judge him. They have a history.

Hamilton is far from his peak, but he could help the Lakers off the bench and has plenty of playoff experience.

DaJuan Summers is included to give the Pistons a little more salary relief, and the Lakers could certainly afford him.

A small consideration for the Lakers should be that the Pistons are sold and Hamilton receives a buyout, freeing him to sign with another contender.

How a Carmelo Anthony trade with the Pistons as third team might work

Based on today’s news the Nets want to include the Pistons in a trade for Carmelo Anthony, I came up with a trade similar to the parameters the teams discussed. Because of salary-cap rules, it’s divided into two parts:

  • Trade one
  • Trade two
  • Plus, as per the original report, the Nets would send the Nuggets at least two first-round picks

To make assessing the deal easier, here’s a team-by-team breakdown:

Detroit Pistons

Trade:

Receive:

  • Troy Murphy
  • Jordan Farmar
  • Johan Petro

Why: They unload Hamilton, saving a significant amount of money the next two years. They get a little bigger, too.

Why not: They add a few million to the payroll this season, and with the current ownership situation, that might not fly – even with the long-term savings. Maybe the Nuggets and/or Nets could send the Pistons cash. Or maybe Tom Gores will buy the team next week.

New Jersey Nets

Trade:

  • Derrick Favors
  • Devin Harris
  • Troy Murphy
  • Sasha Vujacic
  • Jordan Farmar
  • Johan Petro
  • Kris Humphries
  • Ben Uzoh
  • At least two first-round picks

Receive:

  • Carmelo Anthony
  • Chauncey Billups
  • Richard Hamilton
  • Al Harrington
  • Renaldo Balkman
  • Melvin Ely
  • Shelden Williams

Why: I’m not a fan of how strongly they’re pursuing Melo, but if they’re going with that plan, Billups-Hamilton-Melo-Harrington-Brook Lopez makes for a pretty solid lineup.

Why not: They’re absorbing a couple big contracts to get Melo, and this deal is likely contingent on him agreeing to an extension – increasing the long-term payroll even more. Plus, Billups and Hamilton might be washed up.

Denver Nuggets

Trade:

  • Carmelo Anthony
  • Chauncey Billups
  • Al Harrington
  • Renaldo Balkman
  • Melvin Ely
  • Shelden Williams

Receive:

Why: They save a ton of money short and long term, and they get draft picks to rebuild.

Why not: Maybe they think they can get more for Melo.

Chad Ford: Charlotte might make a decent trading partner with the Pistons

From his latest chat, ESPN’s Chad Ford had this response to a question about Rip Hamilton:

Pistons have been close on a few things with Rip, almost landed Tyson Chandler this summer … but he’s not helping himself right now. I think Charlotte is one of the few teams out there with genuine interest.

Sean from Life on Dumars already tackled a possible Charlotte/Detroit swap with a cap-relieving suggestion of Hamilton and Jason Maxiell for Boris Diaw and DeSagana Diop. That’s a nice, practical trade that certainly gives the Pistons some flexibility.

But I like to be impractical, and I would desperately love to see Gerald Wallace as a member of the Pistons.

Trade

Pistons receive:

  • Gerald Wallace
  • DeSagana Diop
  • Matt Carroll
  • Shaun Livingston

Bobcats receive:

Salaries

Data from ShamSports.com

Pistons receive:

Player 2010/11 2011/12 2012/13 2013/14 2014/15
Gerald Wallace $10,500,000 $10,500,000 $10,500,000 $0 $0
DeSagana Diop $6,478,600 $6,925,400 $7,372,200 $0 $0
Matt Carroll $4,300,000 $3,900,000 $3,500,000 $0 $0
Shaun Livingston $3,500,000 $3,500,000 $3,500,000 $0 $0
Total $24,7787,600 $24,825,400 $24,872,000 $0 $0

Bobcats receive:

Player 2010/11 2011/12 2012/13 2013/14 2014/15
Tayshaun Prince $11,148,760 $0 $0 $0 $0
Rip Hamilton $12,500,000 $12,500,000 $12,500,000 $0 $0
Chris Wilcox $3,000,000 $0 $0 $0 $0
DaJuan Summers $762,195 $1,059,293 $0 $0 $0
Total $27,410,955 $13,559,293 $12,500,000 $0 $0
  • Player option
  • Not fully guaranteed
  • Team option
  • Early termination

Pistons’ perspective

From a talent perspective, the Pistons are getting the best player in this trade in Gerald Wallace.

For all of the fans who miss the traditional toughness associated with Pistons basketball, here you go. Wallace is your guy. He hustles, he dives all over the floor, he’s a good defensive player and he’s a good rebounder for a small forward. He’d give the Pistons a very interesting starting frontcourt with Ben Wallace and Greg Monroe joining him.

Unfortunately, to come away with Wallace in this scenario, the Pistons would be taking on two not great contracts to shed themselves of Hamilton’s. Diop is making $21 million for this season and the final two years on his deal. You can bet he’s exercising that player option for $7.3 million in the last year of that deal. And Matt Carroll, although not making a ridiculous sum, is making more than he’s worth at about $12 million through 2012-13. Livingston’s contract is not fully guaranteed in the final year of the deal, so the Pistons could simply release him after next season or use him as an expiring contract next year in another trade.

The plus side to taking on long-term money in this scenario? Diop, though pricey, would at least fill a need as a defensive-minded big body who rebounds and blocks shots. And collectively, with three guys who are overpaid but on a smaller scale than Hamilton is overpaid, it becomes easier to move them in separate deals than it is to move Hamilton. I just can’t see a team taking on Hamilton’s contract and not requiring the Pistons take back bad contracts in return. In this case, at least Diop and Carroll, a good 3-point shooter, can be OK role players.

The Pistons get a player who made the All-Star team last year and makes a pretty reasonable salary for his production level and they clear out a chance for Ben Gordon to start at shooting guard and Austin Daye to get backup minutes at the two and three.

Bobcats’ perspective

There are a couple draws for Charlotte, although I admit it’s tough to expect the Bobcats to give up their longest-tenured player in Wallace.

They do, however, get significant salary relief for the trouble, picking up nearly $15 million in expiring deals to Prince, Wilcox and Summers. Add in Nazr Mohammed’s nearly $7 million in salary that expires at the end of the season, and Charlotte would be in line for some significant costs coming off the books in the offseason.

The Bobcats, one year after making their first playoff appearance in franchise history, are struggling at 9-16, albeit only 1.5 games out of the eighth spot in the East. Acquiring Hamilton and Prince, two players that Larry Brown is very familiar with, would give Charlotte two veteran wings to add to Stephen Jackson. Hamilton’s ability to score without having to dominate the ball for a full possession could help take pressure off of Jackson on offense and Prince’s ability to run the offense could help take some pressure off of D.J. Augustin, as Charlotte sees a significant drop-off in point guard production with Augustin out of the game.

Admittedly, there’s not a huge incentive to do this trade for Charlotte. They’re essentially swapping out Wallace for Hamilton which is a lose. It just depends on how badly Larry Brown wants to shake up his roster (and let’s be honest, LB has been known to want to shake up a roster or two on occasion) and how desperate Charlotte wants to get out of some long-term money owed to Diop and Carroll.

UPDATE: Mike Payne at Detroit Bad Boys had this take on possible Charlotte trades as well, with a menage-a-trois that would net the Pistons Sam Dalembert.