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PistonPowered Mailbag: Maurice Cheeks reaction and (a lot of) trade proposals

Submit questions for the weekly PistonPowered Mailbag to  patrickhayes13(at)gmail(dot)com or on Twitter @patrick_hayes.

I think most fans were aware of how poor a job Maurice Cheeks was doing as coach of the Detroit Pistons. I had a friendly debate with a reader on Twitter about whether or not Cheeks was the worst coach in the league this season “by a landslide” or simply the worst coach in the league. Needless to say when those are the positions taken in a debate, it shouldn’t come as a shock  that Cheeks was fired.

I only have a few thoughts to add to the Cheeks conversation:

* He had talent. Some commenters on the Detroit Free Press column I wrote Friday argued that no coach would win with this roster. That’s simply not true. The Pistons have significantly more talent than they have at any point in the previous four seasons. It’s true that that talent, collectively, does not really mesh all that well, but it’s also true that a more prepared coach with a better offensive and/or defensive system could be getting more out of the roster than Cheeks did.

* Cheeks’ firing should mean the end of Joe Dumars’ tenure as team president. Dumars came into this season with a clear mandate to make the playoffs, with the implication from ownership that if the team didn’t, it would likely cost him his job. So with that type of pressure, and with coaches like Lionel Hollins, George Karl, the Van Gundy brothers, Nate McMillan and a handful of highly regarded assistants on the market, you’re going to roll with … Maurice Cheeks? Dumars doesn’t deserve to be fired for the Cheeks hire alone, but when he chose Cheeks as coach, I had little confidence from that point on that this team was going to perform well enough for Dumars to keep his job.

* I have a major issue with “playoffs or else” ultimatums. I mean … has one ever actually worked? If Tom Gores was at the point of giving Dumars an ultimatum, he should’ve just fired him in the offseason. Most people understandably don’t perform with the long-term health of the organization in mind when their immediate concern is self-preservation. So yes, Dumars damaged the Pistons with several moves this offseason, but ultimately, the responsibility for entrusting him to continue doing this job is on Gores.

* The timing was mildly surprising only because the Pistons are coming off a couple of double-digit home wins against decent teams. But we still shouldn’t be that surprised. I was at the game Saturday with some friends, and seeing this team play from the crowd is really underwhelming. I don’t know how it looked on TV, but in person, it appeared as if both teams were just doing warm-ups. They were getting to the rim on virtually every possession, no one was closing out on shooters, everyone was biting on pump fakes and everyone was diving into passing lanes gambling for steals. Offensively, as we’ve seen all season, the Pistons really don’t run anything. Other than Andre Drummond, who was bound to get better when played the minutes he deserved, and Rodney Stuckey, who is motivated and playing for his next contract, is there anyone on this roster anyone can point to and say, “Maurice Cheeks made that player better?”

On to this week’s mailbag questions (apologies for not getting this up Friday … but I guess it’s a good thing I didn’t considering what would happen over the weekend). Send me more questions and we’ll do another edition this Friday.

What’s your take on the Cheeks firing? After hearing that Dumars really tried to talk Gores out of it, it sure sounds to me like Gores is likely to clean house…. and if that is the case, how do you think this effects our approach to the trade deadline? — Mark

As I said above, I agree with your sentiments that this is the beginning of the end for Dumars. I have no issue with that, either. The time has more than come for Dumars and the organization to part ways. Thanks for the memories, good luck with your future endeavors, etc. Dumars will be fine and probably even work in the league again. The Pistons, however, will enter a period of uncertainty and possibly another rebuilding period depending on what Dumars’ eventual replacement thinks of this roster.

As far as deadline moves, I can’t see Gores allowing Dumars to do much if he really is a lame duck — certainly no moves that would take on long-term salary. Firing Cheeks made it clear Gores would like the team to still make a playoff push, so it’s possible he could sign-off on a minor move or two that brings in a shooter on the cheap, but I’d guess that Dumars is going to have to live or die with the imperfect roster he assembled.

Who would u want as a replacement? I’m thinking Lionel Hollins or George Karl. — Faraz

Either would be fine with me, as long as Dumars isn’t the one making that hire. With the way the Pistons burn through coaches and the way Dumars has historically used coaches as scapegoats, any established coach would be insane to work for him.

I like Hollins because he successfully coached a team featuring a strangely assembled, huge lineup devoid of outside shooters all the way to the Western Conference Finals. He helped Mike Conley become one of the more underrated point guards in the league and he helped Marc Gasol become a highly skilled big man offensively and one of the league’s best defenders. I like Karl because he could run a fast-paced offense that takes advantage of Detroit’s speed and athleticism. I like Jeff Van Gundy because of his ability to coach defense and I like Stan Van Gundy because he surrounded Dwight Howard — whose skillset is obviously a match to what Andre Drummond should develop into — with an array of shooters and made it all the way to the NBA Finals.

Basically, I’m just ready for the Pistons to hire and invest in an established and proven coach rather than a retread.

(Re: My Free Press column Friday) Not sure why you start the article advocating for a coaching change then finish it with the Casey situation in Toronto insinuating coaching stability is what got them to where they are now (despite poor records the prior two seasons). If you’re saying they should fire Mo Cheeks after just over one half a season, just come out and say it. Personally I think he needs more time and some better fitting pieces on the roster. The late game situations aren’t his fault, he’s not out on the floor throwing lazy passes to the other team or allowing dribble penetration or taking poor shots. This team, players and coaches still need more time to gel, grow with each other, learn from mistakes with each other. Take a deep breath Patrick — Chris

OK … I think Mo Cheeks should be fired. I think he never should’ve been hired in the first place. I think when Feldman spent significant time and research ripping the hire (only to himself be ripped for being “too negative”) he was right on the mark. He was the only local writer to significantly look at the red flags in Cheeks’ background suggesting he’s not equipped to be a head coach in the league, and I think the results this season proved him right for doing so.

As far as my column, my point was that coaching stability has hurt the Pistons. But that was not advocating more time for Cheeks. It was point out that the Pistons problem is twofold. First, they have not hired coaches recently worth investing in (Cheeks, Kuester, Curry, Frank). Secondly, their impatience with coaches has probably hurt them as well. I used Casey as an example of a quality candidate who got off to a poor start but eventually turned it around because the front office supported him AND made moves (notably, shedding Rudy Gay and his chucking ways) that helped set Casey up for success. The Pistons have hired coaches who were bad, but they’ve also compounded those poor hires by giving them major roster issues and not making in-season moves to fix those problems. And for the record, the front office did more to support Cheeks than any of his three recent predecessors. Dumars traded Billups, who would’ve undoubtedly made Curry’s first season smoother. Dumars refused to trade or even punish disgruntled, unhappy players who routinely berated and even mutinied on Kuester. He gave Lawrence Frank a playoff mandate and a roster that included Corey Maggette penciled in for a rotation spot before the season started. Cheeks certainly had roster challenges, but he also had a lot more talent than Curry, Kuester or Frank had to work with.

I’m sure you get tons of these, but here’s some trade ideas, from teams that actually make some sense (at least in my fan-dominated mind).  My question is, who says no? — Nathan

Holy wow, Nathan … I’m impressed by your Trade Machine productivity. I would love some research unit at a college to study how many work hours have been wasted since ESPN launched the Trade Machine. I’d be fascinated by that (and also be a major contributor to those wasted hours). I’ll just go down your list:

Wizards say no. They’re a playoff team right now, playing fairly well and, although I’m sure they’d love to have Monroe, the former Georgetown star, in D.C., I can’t see them shaking up a lineup that seems to be playing better together. They also have a playoffs or else mandate for their front office, so with that goal in sight, it’s hard to see them making a major move.

  • Sixers say no. Pistons would definitely do that to get out of Smith’s deal, but I don’t think a rebuilding Philly has any interest in taking on Smith’s contract. They could move Young and Turner in other deals and probably get more value for them.
  • Mavs say no. They’re way to analytically inclined to be tempted into taking Smith unless the Pistons are giving up a draft pick or young player for the trouble.
  • Pistons say no. McGee and Gallo are both injured and really expensive to boot. Would love Wilson Chandler on the Pistons though.
  • Both probably say no. I think Golden State would like Monroe and he’d be a good fit there, but they wouldn’t take on Smith and jeopardize that his shot-happy ways would ruin their vibe as the playoffs approach. Pistons would probably want a better young player than Barnes if they ever became open to moving Monroe.
  • Plausible, but only if Dwight Howard would still like to play with Josh Smith and only if Houston thinks they can fix him by playing him at his natural position.
  • Thunder say no. Ibaka’s contract is reasonable and Perry Jones has actually shown signs of playing well in limited stretches. They’d be taking on a player in Monroe who they might have to max soon, then giving up a really good starter and a really good prospect to pay Josh Smith. Can’t see that happening.
  • Suns say no. They’re on the market for a star-type player, but Josh Smith is not that player. If they want to deal Len and some of their hundreds of first round picks, they could do much better than Smith.
  • Pistons say no. Hayward is not an attractive enough young wing to move Monroe for.

49 Comments

  • Feb 10, 201412:06 pm
    by Branden

    Reply

    Pistons say no to the Rockets deal, why would they want two years of Asik who would just pout here as he did in Houston? He would be backing up Drummond and Asik demands to be a starter.
     And Monroe will probably not bring a better return than a Harrison Barnes or Gordon Hayward. He cannot shoot or protect the rim. He is an unorthodox talent in todays game and that is why he didn’t get an extension and why her hasn’t been moved yet. Washington wants him, but not for Beal. GS does not want him, David lee is better right now and after Moose’s extension will be on a smaller contract.

    • Feb 10, 20141:23 pm
      by Patrick Hayes

      Reply

      They would want two years of Asik because, A., it allows them to dump Smith’s awful deal, and B., there is a market for Asik as a defensively minded, good rebounding center, so they could easily spin him for an asset in another deal.

      You’re under-valuing Monroe. Barnes is a prospect who had a good run late last season but has otherwise been terrible. Hayward is better than Barnes, but still pretty inconsistent. Monroe is a near double-double big man for going on three seasons now. If you can’t see the difference between Monroe vs. Hayward or Barnes … I just … I don’t know what to tell you. He’s clearly superior to and more valuable than either guy.

      • Feb 10, 20145:15 pm
        by JYD for Life

        Reply

        Two things:
        1.  They would get 1.5 years of Asik.  
        2.  Paying 30 million next season for Lin and Asik instead of 40 million for 3 more years of Josh Smith is a huge spend just to essentially dump smith for backup players.   There are better options than that.  I want Smith gone just as much as you do, but this makes about as much sense for the Pistons as it would for the Rockets to add a FT shooter like Smith next to Howard.  
         

      • Feb 10, 20145:16 pm
        by JYD for Life

        Reply

        I guess one more thing…if the market is so great for Asik, why hasn’t Houston been able to move him?  Guess we’ll see over the next 10 days, but he’s not worth spending 15million on him next year regardless if only half of that counts toward the cap #. 
         
         

    • Feb 10, 20141:29 pm
      by oats

      Reply

      Barnes is playing worse than Kyle Singler on a per minute basis this year. Barnes is putting up 12.7 points and 5.1 rebounds per 36 minutes with a true shooting percentage of .500. Singler is putting up 12.4 points and 5.1 rebounds per 36 minutes with a true shooting percentage of .569. You can make excuses for Barnes taking on a lesser role, but efficiency is supposed to improve with a lesser role and his got worse. He’s still the better prospect of the two, but Harrison Barnes projects as a low end to average starter while Monroe is already a solid starter. Sorry, that’s not fair value.

  • Feb 10, 201412:30 pm
    by Moonchild

    Reply

    The wizards would be crazy to say no to that trade, pairing smith and monroe with wall, beal and gortat would be pretty scary in the east..
    The Philly trade would be great for the Pistons, I agree with you, I doubt the Sixers would pull the trigger
    I like Haywayrd a lot besides his inconsistent shooting at times, but hes one of the best all around skilled guards in the league, and hes real young…If you switch Rush with Kanter (Kanter and Favors isn’t going to work, but Monroe and Favors would), I think the Pistons should def do it.

    • Feb 10, 20141:25 pm
      by Patrick Hayes

      Reply

      Maybe … I still don’t think they do it though. Like I said, they have a clear mandate to make the playoffs this season. Right now, they’re on track for that and playing well. I don’t see them jeopardizing that by bringing in two new key players, particularly one who is super expensive and having an awful season.

    • Feb 10, 20141:39 pm
      by oats

      Reply

      @ Moonchild. Hayward’s shooting .306 on 3s this year. That’s really bad, and Detroit does need something back to make up for the fact that they are gambling on him returning to form. Kanter has also been pretty disappointing this year with his poor defense and rebounding. Getting him cuts into Detroit’s cap space and I don’t know how badly I want to do that. Now if it was a JJ for Kanter swap you’d have my attention. Heck, I might settle for a pick or just salary dumping JJ and Bynum.

      • Feb 10, 20144:59 pm
        by Moonchild

        Reply

        @Oats, I understand Haywards shooting struggles this year which I mentioned, but he has a career average of 38% which is solid, especially for a young player in the league…..i think within the next  year he will become a top tier guard, in which he will only be 24
         
        I think bringing Kanter off the bench with some solid guards could be a huge benefit, not saying hes a great player, but i like him as a dependable rotation big. He can put some points and boards up consistently without breaking the bank and disrupting team chemistry
         
         

        • Feb 10, 20146:29 pm
          by oats

          Reply

          .306 on 170 shots is not just inconsistent at times. His shot has abandoned him this year. His strong shooting in the past suggests he can get it back, but how much of it is unclear. Look at what he’s done for his career. He shot .473 on only 74 shots as a rookie, so that number is really unreliable. The next year he shot .346 on 159 shots, and then last year he shot .415 on 246 shots. Normally I’d put more weight on the year with the most shots, but dropping by more than 10% is not just a regular off year. Maybe last year and this year are both anomalies and his second year in the league is closer to the guy he actually is. If so he’s a pretty average efficiency shooter who can pass about as well as Monroe does. He’s not really much better defensively, and he’s pretty average on the boards. He really does need to be better than that for a Monroe trade to make sense.
           
          As for Kanter, he’s got one year left on his deal and that move would cut about $5 million from what Detroit currently has to offer in free agency. He’s probably worth about $5 million I guess, but probably not for Detroit. Even after the trade I’d rather have roughly $10 million to throw at a single player than $5 million for Kanter and $5 million on someone else because a $10 million player is just much more valuable than 2 $5 million players. That’s why I only think he’s really helping out if JJ is getting dumped. Then it’s pretty much just upgrading on JJ without halving the cap space. I still think I’d rather just dump JJ for an expiring deal to increase the team’s cap space to go after an even better free agent than bring back Kanter, but I’m less convinced I’m right on that.

  • Feb 10, 201412:30 pm
    by I HATE LOSING (Predicting A Strong Finish)

    Reply

    Props to Dan he was dead on about Cheeks….and most of the trade are ridiculous….if we want to win now we move Greg not Smith! in case people haven’t noticed Smith offensive and defensive game is really starting to come around…
     
     
     
     
     
    He just does

    • Feb 10, 20141:41 pm
      by oats

      Reply

      I had noticed that he’s just regularly bad instead of really terrible on offense. His defense has been good at the 4 though.

      • Feb 10, 20144:31 pm
        by I HATE LOSING (Predicting A Strong Finish)

        Reply

        Nah…he us attacking more….and he is doing less dribble, dribble settle for Jumper….when he takes the jumper his feet are set or he is stepping into those shots….we might still fringe when he take them but they have been falling

        • Feb 10, 20146:34 pm
          by oats

          Reply

          A 49% true shooting percentage since January is bad and shooting a ton while shooting that poorly is not a good idea. He’s hitting 14% of his 3s and 49% of his free throws. Yeah, he’s still playing bad on offense even if his field goal percentage looks decent. Bad is a big step up for him, but it’s still bad.

  • Feb 10, 201412:34 pm
    by Smitty

    Reply

    Jennings and Monroe for Rondo!

  • Feb 10, 201412:40 pm
    by I HATE LOSING (Predicting A Strong Finish)

    Reply

    Actually I think Golden state would do the trade… Bogus is a fa this summer reports are he want to be part of a team that fits him better…David Lee is not a spring chicken we will be 31 this year and he has had injury concerns for several years…

    • Feb 10, 20141:42 pm
      by oats

      Reply

      I don’t know if that’s a typo or auto-correct, but I got a laugh out of him being called Bogus.

      • Feb 10, 20142:20 pm
        by JYD for Life

        Reply

        Bogut signed an extension that kicks in next season.  
        Either way, Monroe is not a fit for GS and that’s independent of whether or not you think he should be worth more in a trade than Barnes (see what people thought about this idea right after his playoff run and I bet you guys have a different response).  Monroe is due for a large contract extension – Klay Thompson isn’t far behind him.  They have high-priced players in Curry, Bogut and Iguodala right now.  Even if they get out of Lee’s last two years, Monroe is not a fit.  
         
          

        • Feb 10, 20146:46 pm
          by oats

          Reply

          I was one of a handful of posters on here that was arguing that Barnes was being overrated for that playoff run even as it was happening. He was a mediocre rookie who happened to get hot in some high profile games. I’ve always thought it should be Detroit turning down any Monroe for Barnes type of deals.

  • Feb 10, 201412:41 pm
    by I HATE LOSING (Predicting A Strong Finish)

    Reply

    No to Rondo!

    • Feb 10, 201412:44 pm
      by Smitty

      Reply

      Yes to Rondo!

      • Feb 10, 20144:18 pm
        by Anthony

        Reply

        Hell no to Rondo…. Moose and Jennings for a guy who has health problems and cant shoot??? We already have a few of those guys!

  • Feb 10, 201412:47 pm
    by pablum

    Reply

    (1) Wojo’s column in Det News today (2/10/14): “I actually think Dumars might agree it’s time to go.”
    How do you write a sentence like that — and just leave it that way? (He did go on record and say Cheeks was a Joe hire.
    (2) Agreed. Huge props to Dan for his brilliant work on Cheeks.
    (3) Gores only last week declared — after months of silence — that “Patience” was his first position regarding the team’s very terrible season this year. Ergo: He’s either (1) a cold-blooded liar; (2) Drummond told him Cheeks sucked (however diplomatically, or not); (3) Gores has the temperament of a fan, which is great for us, but not great if you’re running the team as fans are fans for a reason. (It appears a lot of pro NBA writers felt Cheeks at least deserved to finish out the season. Not me. I’m a fan. And as a fan, it was clear to me Cheeks was a “fucking idiot.” — (to quote an actual fan).
     

    • Feb 10, 20142:28 pm
      by JYD for Life

      Reply

      Pablum – your quote was awesome!  I’m still laughing. 
       
      Wojo seriously destroyed all credibility today when he also wrote something along the lines of drafting KCP over Trey Burke was “inexplicable and the long-term damage to the franchise could be staggering.”  Really?  That’s from a respected journalist?  No homerism there at all.  He’s entitled to his opinion, but that was a pretty dramatic statement and regardless of how KCP turns out, we can probably all agree (even the Burke lovers out there) that Trey is not a franchise altering talent.   

      • Feb 10, 20142:31 pm
        by Patrick Hayes

        Reply

        I don’t know whether Burke is or isn’t. I do know that KCP is not. That’s a good enough justification for drafting one over the other, even if Wojo was a bit hyperbolic in his description.

        • Feb 10, 20143:23 pm
          by Mike

          Reply

          lol at “we don’t know” with Burke. Take off the homer glasses and look at the numbers. Compare them to Brandon Jennings. Every possible issue about Burke before the draft has been true so far. Not getting into the paint. Not getting to the line. Can’t finish inside the 3-point arc. Can’t guard other PGs. People seriously need to stop with the Burke stuff.

          • Feb 10, 20143:44 pm
            by Patrick Hayes

            First of all, don’t “lol” like a goddamned 12-year-old. Be a professional.

            Secondly, Burke has two things going for him as a pro. He’s a great pick and roll PG (and, if you have noticed watching the league for the last, oh, 30 years or so, pick and roll point guards are pretty valuable). Secondly, he takes phenomenal care of the basketball. PGs who pass well and never turn it over, even with other limitations, tend to be pretty valuable (which is how 1,000-year-old Jose Calderon can get a $40 million deal despite the fact that he plays no D). 

            I don’t have “rose colored glasses” on. I’m not a Michigan fan. I’m just a competent enough basketball watcher to know that Burke already does a couple of really valuable things well that could translate into a great career for him if he improves enough in the weak spots in his game. Thus far, Caldwell-Pope does one thing (defense) well and sucks at the other thing (3-point shooting) he was supposed to be good at. Call me crazy, but I think one of those two prospects has proven more as a pro than the other.

        • Feb 10, 20145:04 pm
          by JYD for Life

          Reply

          But hang on a second, Patrick…this started because I called Wojo out for claiming Trey Burke was capable of altering a franchise.  
           
          In this post, you’re saying that he’s going to be a “valuable” player.  That’s not the point.  
           
          Also – you haven’t seen enough from either player to make that determination.  Using your logic, we can argue that Burke does one thing well (pass – 5 assists is pretty marginal for a starting PG).   There is nothing to show that KCP won’t improve as much, if not more than Burke at shooting.   Look at the numbers…by your logic, if KCP had the same usage rate and shot attempts, he already would be more valuable than Burke.  
           

          EASON
          TEAM
          GP
          GS
          MIN
          FGM-A
          FG%
          3PM-A
          3P%
          FTM-A
          FT%
          OR
          DR
          REB
          AST
          BLK
          STL
          PF
          TO
          PTS

          ’13-’14

          DET

          48
          40
          24.1
          2.7-6.8
          .396
          0.9-2.7
          .321
          0.6-0.8
          .757
          0.4
          1.7
          2.1
          0.9
          0.1
          1.1
          2.1
          0.4
          6.8

           

          SEASON
          TEAM
          GP
          GS
          MIN
          FGM-A
          FG%
          3PM-A
          3P%
          FTM-A
          FT%
          OR
          DR
          REB
          AST
          BLK
          STL
          PF
          TO
          PTS

          ’13-’14

          UTAH

          38
          36
          30.9
          4.8-12.8
          .373
          1.6-4.8
          .339
          1.5-1.7
          .906
          0.5
          2.6
          3.1
          5.5
          0.1
          0.6
          2.1
          2.0
          12.7

          • Feb 10, 20145:06 pm
            by JYD for Life

            Sorry that didn’t paste as I thought it would…Anyway…there is nothing within those numbers that screams this was a “franchise altering” decision to draft KCP over Burke.  Get over it.  

          • Feb 10, 20149:18 pm
            by Patrick Hayes

            Burke’s assist numbers aren’t great because he’s passing to a lot of teammates who can’t shoot. That’s not a reflection of his passing, it’s ability of the general terribleness of the roster around him that was designed to tank this season. I’m confident his assist numbers will climb with better teammates. My point was that, as a rookie playing the most difficult position in the league, he’s close to elite level when it comes to taking care of the ball. He’s also been very good in pick and rolls. Those are two pretty good indicators he’ll be a decent NBA point guard.

            I’m also not that concerned about his shooting. Again, his team is awful. He’s being asked to carry too much of the load on offense, and that has impacted his shot selection/shooting percentages. He’s basically a first option for Utah. You can’t really compare his production/responsibility with Caldwell-Pope, who has been asked to do very little and, other than occasionally promising defense, has responded by doing very little.

            I’m not convinced Caldwell-Pope is going to be a bust. He might be a good NBA starter. But so far, based on their college and limited pro bodies of work, Burke is the superior player and prospect. 

          • Feb 11, 20145:16 pm
            by JYD for Life

            I’ll concede that Burke is the “superior prospect” and probably player.  As you mentioned though, it’s about fit and Dumars/Gores didn’t want a rookie PG.  If KCP were on Utah and getting the same shot attempts, I think we can assume that his numbers (without the assists, but with much better defense) would be similar to Burkes.  
             
            All of that aside – this debate began because I called out Wojo for saying that passing on Burke was “inexplicable and the long-term damage to the franchise could be staggering.”
            Nothing within your defense points to why passing on Burke, who will be a decent point guard – which I never said he wouldn’t, should be considered staggering or detrimental to the franchise’s future.  
             
            It’s also funny how neither you nor Wojo mention Michael Carter Williams, who is and will be better than Trey Burke.  
             

          • Feb 11, 20146:38 pm
            by Tim Thielke

            MCW doesn’t get brought up for the same reason we don’t talk about drafting Milicic over Wade. Even though Wade was the second best player to go in that draft, he was a far inferior prospect at the time of the draft to Anthony.

            MCW had a hot start this year but has really cooled off. I’m not convinced on either count that he is or will be better than Burke. Both are possible, neither is a given. But Burke was the better prospect at the time of the draft.

  • Feb 10, 20141:17 pm
    by Paul

    Reply

    Monroe and Stuckey for Chandler Parsons and Asik. I think it would be good for Houston and the Pistons. 

  • Feb 10, 20141:38 pm
    by I HATE LOSING (Predicting A Strong Finish)

    Reply

    I will agree that we missed out by holding on to Greg so long, we have lost a lot of leverage..
    Falk is gonna have Dumars by the nuts

  • Feb 10, 20141:40 pm
    by I HATE LOSING (Predicting A Strong Finish)

    Reply

    Barnes and a pick….would be good for me….

    • Feb 10, 20141:45 pm
      by oats

      Reply

      They don’t have a pick to send out until the 2016 draft.

  • Feb 10, 20141:41 pm
    by Vic

    Reply

    Everybody is bashing Joe D but all the national and local journalistic headhunters trying to fire him, nobody is mentioning these particular facts:
    - His first owner fired his only 2 quality coaches. - Then his owner died. - Then his owners daughter didn’t care, and struggled to sell the team. - This new owner is only in his 2nd season. So yeah Joe D. has definitely made some errors but he’s not the entire problem by himself.
    He’s sat thru 3 owners and his first owner fired his only 2 quality coach picks.
    Of course he’s made mistakes but nobody wants to balance out the story…

  • Feb 10, 20141:45 pm
    by I HATE LOSING (Predicting A Strong Finish)

    Reply

    Never mind warriors have no picks….i wish the Suns could offer us something 

  • Feb 10, 20142:51 pm
    by Todd

    Reply

    What makes me laugh is that all of the trade proposals (according to Hollinger’s statistical model) make us worse. Seriously? Get rid of any player on our roster that currently is trade bait or we would like to trade and it makes us worse, really? How does that happen?

  • Feb 10, 20143:16 pm
    by Todd

    Reply

    What about if Detroit works to facilitate the trade between the Suns and the Lakers - http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=lp2gg3p and in return we get one of the Suns 1st rounders for this year? We give up on this year, but get a true stretch 4 that can open up some looks when paired together with Drummond or Smith. We dump Okafor’s $14.5 off the books in the summer (same as we should/would do with Stuckey and CV) and get a pick and push forward to tank (or not). 

    • Feb 10, 20145:07 pm
      by JYD for Life

      Reply

      So you want to trade Monroe and two expiring contracts for Channing Frye and a borderline D-Leaguer? That’s basically what that boils down to.  

    • Feb 10, 20147:33 pm
      by DetroitP

      Reply

      Channing Frye and a D leaguer………. Seriously? and most of these trades on here are dumb as shit.  Yeah lets trade Moose and Josh Smith for shitty and older Nene and Otto porter whose a complete bust?  yeah okkkkk

  • Feb 10, 20143:17 pm
    by Huddy

    Reply

    I don’t agree that Smith isn’t right for the suns.  With their assets they can probably do better, but they would have to use more assets to do so.  With Smith they could give the pistons a players on a better deal and a pick and still have a few picks to woto with.  Any legit star is going to cost considerably more.  Considering they could remain flexible and acquire Smith I think he is A good fit.

  • Feb 10, 20143:25 pm
    by mannietooth

    Reply

    I wish they’d do this:
     
    http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=m8xv465
     
     

    • Feb 10, 20145:10 pm
      by Todd

      Reply

      I like adding in Gordon as a shooter and Terrence Jones as a young big, but the problem with this trade is that we again have too many of our best players stuck in the same roles (the 4 & 5). If we could slightly alter your trade and make it this - http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=k8j5wqu I would be THRILLED! Imagine, we could give up Smith, Monroe, and CV and get back Chandler, Gordon, Canaan, and Jones. The trade gives Daryl Morey some cap room to play with, the Pelicans get some more veteran players that can add some size to their frontline for when they go up against the bigs in the West. 

      • Feb 10, 20145:18 pm
        by Tim Thielke

        Reply

        The Rockets overvalue Asik, but they looooove Parsons. Not a chance they’d give up both for Monroe. And then you want them to throw in Jones too?

  • Feb 10, 20143:26 pm
    by Mike

    Reply

    Monroe to the Suns for some of those 1st rounders makes more sense to me. Maybe give up this year’s Washington pick + one of their picks next year? Maybe that’s even too much for Phoenix, given Monroe’s play this year and contract situation.

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