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3-on-3: Looking toward the Pistons in 2014

Modeled after ESPN’s 5-on-5, three of us will answer three questions about a Pistons-related topic. Please add your responses in the comments.

1. What do the Pistons have to look forward to in 2014?

Dan Feldman: Andre Drummond‘s rise. As good as Drummond is right now, he has so much room to get better. The Pistons barely run plays for him, and he still gets lost defensively. His physical profile lends itself to much more on both ends.

Tim Thielke: A playoff berth. The Pistons are going through a bit of a slump right now, but they’re still in the playoff picture. And as long as they can get above the 7th seed, they have a real shot at the second round, too.

Brady Fredericksen: Growth. There’s obviously been plenty of ups and downs so far with this roster, but as the team learns more and more about what they need to do, the more consistently they’ll show up as the Good Pistons who beat Indiana and Miami and not the Bad Pistons, who are currently sleepwalking through the December snow.

2. What’s the team’s biggest challenge moving forward?

Dan Feldman: Figuring out what to do with Josh Smith and Greg Monroe. Assuming Drummond is a constant at center, the Pistons need a forward combination that works with him. Maybe those two develop into that tandem, but so far, it hasn’t worked. So, now what? Monroe, because of his age and contract, is more valuable — both to the Pistons and in a trade. 

Tim Thielke: Putting all their pieces together. The Pistons are currently a “whole less than the sum of the parts” team. The good thing about that is that leaves tons of room for internal growth. That growth is certainly not a given, but it’s available.

Brady Fredericksen: Finding consistency in their identity. This is a flawed team, and we’ve gotten far enough into the season to know what the “good” version of these guys looks like. They’re capable of being a very good rebounding team and a pretty solid offensive unit when they’re forcing turnovers. If the Pistons are to keep improving, it starts and ends with their defense and ability to force turnovers — which will fuel their offense.

3. Let’s be bold: What’s going to be the surprise of 2014 for the Pistons?

Dan Feldman: The Pistons will hire a coach with NBA head-coaching experience. I don’t know whether or not that will to replace Maurice Cheeks, but it might be if the Pistons miss the playoffs (which would likely mean a new general manager, who might want to hire his own coach). If the Pistons make the playoffs — likely keep Joe Dumars at the helm — but just sneak in and get knocked out quickly, that wouldn’t leave Cheeks on solid footing. In that case, I could see the Pistons hiring an assistant who previously worked as a head coach both to improve the staff and to have a viable replacement in case they fire Cheeks mid-season.

Tim Thielke: Monroe has a disappointing second half of the season and then nobody lines up to offer him a deal in free agency because they don’t think he’s worth max money and they figure Dumars would match anything less. Monroe has to settle for $41M/4 yrs and then establishes himself as Detroit’s best player on his new deal. Excessive optimism? Definitely. But why not? This is supposed to be a surprising turn of events.

Brady Fredericksen: There’s going to be a panicky trade, soon. I’m not sure to what extreme that trade will be, but I’m confident in thinking that the Eastern Conference is eventually going to take a step up from sucking to just being bad. That means the Pistons are going to have to take a step up, too. If things are looking iffy for this team come next month, Dumars may make some sort of quick-fix trade; maybe moving Monroe or Brandon Jennings. Dumars’ fate is linked to this season’s team — if they sink, so does he. Plain and simple.

76 Comments

  • Jan 2, 20142:31 pm
    by Otis

    Reply

    1) Finally being rid of Joe Dumars. If not, this will be conclusive evidence that there is no God.
     
    2) I fervently disagree that the Pistons being a whole less than the sum of its parts is an indication that there’s this tremendous room for growth like Tim suggests. Especially considering this problem has been a constant over the past half decade. If no combination of your talent results in a good team, you’re sunk. And that’s the challenge. No internal “fix” is going to mean shit. Move the pieces you have for pieces that fit. This should not be a challenge, by the way, but for some reason it’s the most insurmountable thing in the world to just suck it up and make a few trades that should NOT be as hard as people are making them out to be. So long Greg. So long Rodney. Have a nice life, be total Piston killers, it’s fine. And I won’t miss either one of you. This should not be a challenge, but boy is it ever, apparently.
     
    3) Nothing surprises me anymore when it comes to this team. When your organization is completely broken at every level– ownership, GM, talent, probably all the way down concessions– the only thing that would surprise me is if this team manages to fix itself without DRASTIC changes.

    • Jan 2, 20144:06 pm
      by Tim Thielke

      Reply

      “If no combination of your talent results in a good team, you’re sunk.”

      There are 3 different combinations that work really well. The eye test (and basic logic) had already told me as much, but Schumann really confirms it:
      https://twitter.com/johnschuhmann/status/417335699906371585/photo/1

      Hat tip to I HATE FRANK and gmehl for posting the link.

      • Jan 2, 20146:54 pm
        by Otis

        Reply

        “Really” well? Maybe better than other rubbish combinations, but I’m not going to endorse any formula that involves one of these three guys glued to the bench at all times. It makes no sense whatsoever. No team in this league who couldn’t play their top three guys together ever accomplished anything.

        • Jan 2, 20147:52 pm
          by Tim Thielke

          Reply

          Yes, really well. They are +6.3/game with two of the three playing. That would be the 5th best mark in the league (in between Miami and Portland).

          Not playing your three best players together may be radical, but that doesn’t mean it can’t work. And always having one of them on the bench is a great formula. They’ve been doing a phenomenal job with two of the three on the floor.

          Trading one if you can good value is a great plan. But if you can’t, keeping them all is a good plan because if you only have two, then you have to spend much of the game with only one or none on the floor. With all three, not only do you have injury insurance, but you can play some pair for every minute of every game.

          What the Pistons need is a smart coach who can put together an unorthodox game plan. There are tons who have a proven track record of doing so in college.

          • Jan 3, 20149:45 am
            by Vic

            It wasn’t hard to see this at all I’ve been recommending staggering the big 3 since before preseason started. It’s actually a competitive advantage because you can abuse the other team with starting quality bigs for 48 minutes straight.
            It just takes strategic courage to do it that’s all.
            Pistons championship teams have always had starting quality bigs coming off the bench, from Memo/ Corliss to Rodman/Salley

          • Jan 3, 201411:12 am
            by Huddy

            Otis can’t wrap his mind around discussing the team as is without focusing on the team as he would like it.  @Tim like you said, if a quality trade exists great, but in the mean time this is the team and it makes sense to try and maximize its output.  Staggering the big guys is the best policy regardless of who needs to start on the bench to do so.  At the very least it makes sense for the organization to explore all options so that it can further prove the necessity for a trade if that formula fails.  As long as there are strategies that are not being tried there will be arguments for why the team should hold off on a trade so regardless of your opinion on trading the team should be trying to get the most out of what they currently have.

          • Jan 3, 201412:44 pm
            by Otis

            Tim, there is no question this team would be better off rotating their three bigs at the power positions. I’ve said this from day one. But at this point, given Monroe’s looming extension and the rapidly approaching trade deadline, I don’t think there’s enough time to employ that strategy and commit to this formula. We still have perhaps the worst perimeter in the league, there is no way to slice it so that a max contract makes sense for Moose, and as usual we’re perpetually ignoring the perimeter punch we’d be adding by trading Moose. So if we’re a +6.3 per game with two of our bigs on the floor, shit we’re probably a +12.6 with a quality wing scorer flanking them. Then you can deal with the lows of when one or none are on the floor together, as all teams deal with having to rest their best guys.
             
            It’s just too important in basketball to have the best player, the best unit, the best handful of players. If we could manage to win a shitload of games by rotating these guys at the four and five, I’d have to see it with my own eyes and we’d have to be one of the best teams in the league to justify that self-imposed handicap. It’s absurdly unconventional, and there are better ways to use your resources.

          • Jan 3, 20141:12 pm
            by Tim Thielke

            “So if we’re a +6.3 per game with two of our bigs on the floor, shit we’re probably a +12.6 with a quality wing scorer flanking them.”

            Yeah, if you can get an elite wing for Monroe that can do that (James, Durant, or George), definitely do it. Jump all over that trade! Heck, if you can get a wing who does half that (Anthony, Harden, or Batum, maybe Leonard, Parsons, Thompson, or Iggy), you take that too. Do you think Monroe can be traded for any of those 10 players? Because if not, there really aren’t many guys left who are huge upgrades over Singler/KCP.

            And if you’re not a +12.6 but a +6.7 or something, it really will hurt that you can’t play Smith+Drummond 48 mpg. From the get go, I’ve agreed with you that if you can get great value back for Monroe, you do it. But if you are forcing a trade, you don’t get great value. And you have yet to tell me who you think Monroe will fetch in return.

            Seriously, you’re about 200,000,000 comments (I can use hyperbole, too) into this conversation and still have yet to state what you think Monroe can fetch. So do tell us (and not “a quality wing”, that means nothing, how good is quality? how old is this quality wing? how much does he make? is he someone with a fairly consistent talent appraisal or is he someone who some fans love and others couldn’t care less about?). It will help everyone put your comments into more context.

          • Jan 3, 20142:19 pm
            by Max

            Good stuff, Tim. 

      • Jan 3, 201412:53 pm
        by Otis

        Reply

        @Huddy: Once again you’re leaning towards standing pat, which would be our worst possible strategy at the deadline. If Monroe were our ONLY quality big man I’d bite the bullet and reluctantly give him that bullshit max extension in the hopes of him improving his defense and his jumper. Drummond’s presence changes everything, and as I’ve said 100 times before, avoiding handing Monroe this contract is basically priority #1. He is not worth it, it’s going to be virtually impossible to get the quality of play out of him to justify it, let alone establish value in the contract. He has been on a plateau since he was 21, and he hasn’t improved enough in areas of weakness that have been glaring since his rookie year.
         
        Also, confoundingly, you say: “As long as there are strategies we haven’t tried, there is no reason to call for a trade…” but THIS TEAM IS NOT TRYING ANY STRATEGIES. They’re just trotting out the same bullshit game after game, and it’s not working. It’s like an addict refusing to go into treatment because he hasn’t tried attending AA meetings first, but then he never goes to AA. The organization is doing absolutely nothing to address the problem, just like this organization ALWAYS does. They never address anything. We’ll be waiting LONG past the deadline for them to exhaust every possibility. Your trust in this team’s dysfunction is mortifying.

        • Jan 3, 20141:36 pm
          by Huddy

          Reply

          Copy and paste is ctrl + c followed by ctrl + v…maybe that will help you not misquote and ultimately misrepresent what I say.
           
          “As long as there are strategies that are not being tried there will be arguments for why the team should hold off on a trade”  thats what I actually said.  I did not say there is “no reason to call for a trade”.  I said people will continue to argue the potential of the line up with the team doesnt explore other options.  As long as things can still be pinned on coaching errors and such it will be harder to prove without question that a trade is necessary. 
           
          You waste soo much BS ranting without even reading what I actually wrote.  I am not leaning toward anything.  I specifically said a trade is a good idea and in the mean time it makes sense to try different combinations with the current line up EVEN IF ONLY TO FURTHER PROVE THE NECESSITY OF A TRADE.  I 100% UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THEY ARE NOT TRYING DIFFERENT STRATEGIES WHICH IS WHY I SAID THEY NEED TO START.  Save your finger strength and use your eyes.  My point is simply that until a trade presents itself it is senseless to continue and trot out using the same strategy.  In defense of your point it only leaves more questions as to what the real issue is (coaching or fit) ((again not my opinion just in general a possibility)) and if the team is going to stay the same they should at least put their best foot forward.  Are you really wasting your time trying to argue that the Pistons should continue their same strategy?  No.  Have I or Tim stated that a trade is a bad idea? No.  What is your point? 

          • Jan 3, 20142:20 pm
            by Max

            Hell yeah, Huddy!   Down goes Otis!  Down goes Otis! 

    • Jan 2, 201410:15 pm
      by Max

      Reply

      @Otis   Here’s another rhetorical reply from me since you don’t answer me.  How can you say the Pistons have had the problem of being less than the sum of their parts for half a decade in order to argue against the idea that they have tremendous room for improvement when this is the only year in the past half decade when their roster has featured much talent at all?   Your points are just way too over the top sometimes.   

  • Jan 2, 20142:32 pm
    by Maximus

    Reply

    That ball dont lie !!!
    Pistons should trade josh smith for a sac of pracrice balls!!
    Also, jennings for a box of gatorade !!
    Bring back kwame brown and Darko.
    Resign ben wallace as the point guard of the future…lol
    Sign shaq as a shooring guard.
    1) Ben wallace -PG
    2) Shaq -SG
    3)  Dwight howard -SF
    4)  Mugsy bogus -PF
    5) Chris paul – C
    Championshiop #4 guaranteed….

  • Jan 2, 20142:34 pm
    by Keith

    Reply

    I’m probably going to be unpopular for saying this, but I think this slump, and a prolonged period of terrible play, would be the best thing for the team. Remember when Golden State tanked the second half of their season to ensure they landed within the top 8 picks (ironically the same place we need to land)? It was obvious, and a little frustrating, but it was the smartest thing they could do. They weren’t good enough to make any noise in the playoffs, and they ended up with Harrison Barnes (a player many of use would love to trade Greg Monroe for).

    Quite simply, the Pistons are not a good team. They are good enough to make the playoffs in a terrible Eastern conference, but that doesn’t make them a good team. And even if Joe D manages to turn Greg Monroe or Josh Smith into a third tier wing, we are going to be a flawed team without elite talent (Drummond alone can’t put us on the Indiana-Miami level). I’m saying it now, this team should be tanking. We have a ton of money next year that we are either going to tie up into an ill-fitting player (Monroe) or have to throw at another second tier pseudo star. Rather than continuing the mistakes of the past, I think it best that we give ourselves a chance at another cornerstone player. One that can actually grow with Drummond, not be a perpetual weight around his neck.

    • Jan 2, 20143:16 pm
      by Huddy

      Reply

      A trade involving a pick would be more hopeful.  With 10+ teams at or below the pistons at this point it is pretty dangerous to try and get down to a level where they don’t lose their pick to Charlotte.  

  • Jan 2, 20143:48 pm
    by DoctorDaveT

    Reply

    1. Playoffs. After having been absent for so long, a playoff appearance will do wonders for their psyche. Expect a 5 seed – and a second round appearance.
    2. PF/SF situation. Good news: there is enough minutes for Moose & Smith to coexist. The Bad news is that they should share court time as little as possible. IF they can get 42-45 minutes of C time from Drummond/Moose & 42-45 minutes of PF time from Moose/Smith – and a rotation that works – this team can be scary good (in 2015-2016, once they’ve had time to grow together).
    3. Kyle Singler becomes 6th Man of the Year candidate, based solely on his second half stats. If he can contribute 20 minutes a night at SG/SF and do it well, this team may not need its 2014 1st round pick.

    • Jan 2, 20144:16 pm
      by Tim Thielke

      Reply

      “IF they can get 42-45 minutes of C time from Drummond/Moose & 42-45 minutes of PF time from Moose/Smith”

      That would require Drummond playing 42-45 mpg. He has nowhere near the stamina nor the ability to avoid fouling to make that possible. On the plus side, Monroe and Smith have played well together–when Drummond isn’t on the court.

      • Jan 2, 20144:29 pm
        by Parsons

        Reply

        I think you read that wrong. Drummond AND Monroe should combine for 42-45 minutes. Not Drummond playing 42-45 minutes alone. He would share it with Monroe meaning Monroe would get 12-15 minutes at Center which is what we’re already doing anyway.

        • Jan 2, 20144:31 pm
          by Tim Thielke

          Reply

          Yeah, you’re right. I did. What you said is pretty much what I’ve been advocating for all season (and really since Smith signed on).

          • Jan 2, 20146:57 pm
            by Otis

            And while staggering those three is better than playing them together, the best option by a wide margin would be to trade one of them (oh, let’s say Greg) for something you can use to build around the other two. You can’t leave $13-15 mil and/or Andre Drummond sitting on the bench at all times.

          • Jan 2, 201410:25 pm
            by Max

            I really wish you were the GM for just long enough to accurately survey the landscape in terms of a Monroe trade.  What would happen when every decent player you asked for was taken off the table before you’d finished your sentence?   I really wonder if you were in such a position if you’d actually trade Monroe for the crap that is available right now for him.   Would you really trade Monroe for a mediocre wing at best with little to no upside?  I wonder.  I’m guessing you wouldn’t but who knows since you truly hate him.   

  • Jan 2, 20144:40 pm
    by Einstein

    Reply

    3. My Surprise of 2014 – Detroit learns a rotation that allows them to shoot the deep ball w/ accuracy and we see the return of the unstoppable Bynum & Drummond pick n roll. If our rotation is going to include Billups, Bynum, Stuckey, & Singler off the bench, there has to be room for either Charlie V, Jorts, or Jonas at the 4 for at least some minutes to help spread the court and shoot the 3. 
    Detroit can essentially have two lineups – a starting lineup focused around post ups & offense rebounding, pick & roll, & guard penetration, & a second unit/bench focused on Stuckey posting/slashing & the Bynum/Drummond pick n roll with spot up opportunities for our 3-point shooters (Billups, Singler, Datome/Charlie V/Jorts/Jonas).

  • Jan 2, 20144:46 pm
    by Parsons

    Reply

    1. Next season. I hate to be a downer but this season isn’t going so well.

    2. This season. We’re a mess right now and most of the blame is probably going to go to playing 33 games in 63 days. Tough but we should be better than this. I see 33 games in 63 days and think we’ll wait on trading.

    3. A new team in next season including coach and GM. If we continue to suck Joe D should be gone. More coaching turmoil combined with a new GM and bad year should lead to a new coach. A real GM who knows 2 centers and 2 of the least efficient players in the league won’t work should lead to a roster shake up. Then our free agents shouldn’t come back. We could have at least 5 new players probably more next year and a new GM and coach.

    • Jan 2, 20146:59 pm
      by Otis

      Reply

      The only people who are going to blame 33 games in 63 days for our performance are shameless apologists. There was nothing about this team that ever looked promising before opening day. They’ve been disappointing even by conservative projections, but it’s not the schedule. It’s the formula.

      • Jan 2, 20148:02 pm
        by Parsons

        Reply

        I read that on the Pistons mailbag. The 1st 2 questions were about Drummod and KCP being worn down by our rough schedule. I agree its the formula (or lack there of) thats the problem but from an organization standpoint that sounded more like (for KCP and Drummond at least) they blame the schedule. Still I hope something happens soon we suck and we’re not getting any better. I don’t see why we waited this long to dump Monroe anyway but now I don’t see us trading him until the all star break. Did we really sign Smith to be a SF? I can’t believe someone could be that stupid. I originally thought Monroe would be traded by the start of the season but that was before I knew we were serious about Smith playing the 3. Now I just see Dumars waiting and hoping we get better after our week vacation and not doing anything until the all star break.

        http://www.nba.com/pistons/chat/mailbag_140101_1.html
        The link if you haven’t read it.

        • Jan 2, 201410:33 pm
          by Max

          Reply

          So I guess you are all for a panic trade.  Those trades almost work.  Really, they do.  

          • Jan 2, 201410:34 pm
            by Max

            Almost always.  

        • Jan 3, 201412:57 pm
          by Otis

          Reply

          LOL Parsons, buddy. The organization will point the finger anywhere but itself. The list of excuses they’ve made since 2009 is longer than my arm. They point the finger every which way but at SHIT management. So I’d take literally anything you ever read in the mailbag with a pound of salt. Keith Langlois is not going to come out and say that the team is bad because Joe Dumars has been the worst GM in professional sports in the last five years.

          • Jan 3, 20145:22 pm
            by Parsons

            I took it as no roster moves coming to be honest. Yes it should be taken with a grain of a salt but a lot of people thought we’d change up the roster or the rotation or something and it hasn’t happened. 6 days off all I’ve heard is we scheduled an extra practice and told KCP to play more like Singler. If I was Tom Gores I’d be getting pretty impatient. Nothing we’ve done screams championship on the horizon it more screams captain theres an ice berg ahead. Hearing 33 games in 63 days being used as an excuse and a coach that isn’t seeing eye to eye with our highest paid player is just making this feel like the T-Mac season again, just with Drummond to make us feel better.

          • Jan 3, 20145:35 pm
            by Max

            I only think there’s no sign of championships on the horizon and icebergs ahead if we’re speaking in terms of the short term.   In the long term, the Pistons have one of the 2-3 best under 25 players in the league which should eventually lead to them being an elite team if Drummond hits his potential and he is already a great player.  Any moves made now should be in consideration of a few years from now and not for the present so charting practices, scheduling and what Cheeks is doing is pretty irrelevant.  If the Pistons ever do contend again, Cheeks will surely be gone by then.  
            This is what so many here are not seeing.   The whole debate about whether to trade Monroe should be centering around what the team will be like a few years from now and not how the current team fits or looks from night to night.   

    • Jan 2, 201410:32 pm
      by Max

      Reply

      @Parsons   Funny how you predict Dumars will be replaced by a real GM when over 90 percent of GMs prove themselves to be nearly totally incompetent and never sniff the sustained success enjoyed by Dumars for even single seasons.  There are some GMs that seem to whiff on every single draft pick even when they pick in the top half of the lottery every single year.  No, if Joe goes, the chances are better than not that someone truly incompetent will replace him and proceed to snuff out even the potential that this admittedly awful team still holds.  

      • Jan 2, 201411:41 pm
        by Parsons

        Reply

        His “sustained success” was 10 years ago. His last 6 or 7 years have been an embarrassment. Trading Afflalo and Amir for nothing, the Chauncey trade, Ben Gordan and Charlie V, now thinking Smith is a SF, theres a small list of his “sustained success”. Not even mentioning his coaching carousel. Yes I want a Monroe trade. Get his 10-16 million out of here and give me a guy that fits. Monroe is a terrific player but when Smith got signed Monroe should have been traded then and there. He has value I don’t know where your getting that no one wants a 23 year old center who is almost an all star so someones going want him. Also 90% of GMs fail? 8 teams can the title this year, 8/30= more than 10%. For real though I’m surprised Joe D still has a supporter.

        • Jan 2, 201411:56 pm
          by Max

          Reply

          Only 4 teams will get to the conference finals, only 2 teams get to the finals and only one team wins the championship and Dumars won a title, got the conference finals six years in a row, the playoffs more than that and got the team to the finals twice in a row including one trip more recently than 10 years ago followed by more trips to the conference finals so your math is way off.  
          I don’t think no one wants a 23 year old center like Monroe.  I do think the only decent trades for him that are not a total disgrace include and in this order: Batum, Leonard, Beal, Parsons, Heyward and Afflalo–and Afflalo is the absolute end of the barrel.   I just don’t think any of these players are currently available and if not, any Monroe trade is bound to be a bad short sighted trade.  I’m all for trading Monroe but I want it done after this weird season when draft picks are at an all time premium.  One of these players might be available at the end of the season or next year but next year there will more acceptable trades because the players can come with draft picks.  
            

          • Jan 3, 20148:24 am
            by oats

            I am not entirely sold on Hayward. His 3 point shooting this year is a little scary. I know it’s early in the season (although 133 attempts is not exactly an insignificant sample size), and I know that he is hindered by being asked to do too much on a really bad team. Still, he’s shooting .293. That’s pretty terrible. He’s also shooting only .400 from the field, giving him a pretty lousy true shooting percentage of .500. I might be more willing to take the bet that he will regress back towards his mean if he was a competent defender, but I’ve always felt he was pretty lousy on that side of the ball. I think I’d rather have Afflalo to be honest.
             
            I could also be easily talked into packages centered around Avery Bradley or Dion Waiters. Boston and Cleveland both have a lot of young talent and a bunch of draft picks stockpiled. Bradley is a solid defender who is hitting his 3s now, although he is a bit short for a SG. Waiters is more of a dribble penetration guard, but he has also started hitting his relatively limited 3 point attempts. Neither of those guys are close to enough on their own of course, but if those teams are interested enough they can both come up with some intriguing offers.

          • Jan 3, 201411:05 am
            by Huddy

            @oats Monroe is a pretty nice fit for Cleavland as well, especially since Bynum is all but gone.  Waiters and a pick?  I think that is reasonable.  The Pistons slide Smith over and take the rest of the season to work out how KCP/Singler/Waiters fit between the SG and SF positions.  The Pistons would have a chance at a decent rookie in the draft and plenty of money to spend or use to acquire a high dollar contract.  Depending on the pick it may seem a little cheap for Monroe considering Waiters is still pretty unproven and hasn’t really shown what role he is best in, but the flexibility is worth a lot to the pistons as well.
             
            I feel pretty much the same about Bradley and I think his height is less of an issue because he is pretty proficient with the ball in his hands.  He could be used to rest Jennings when D is a priority and with KCP on the roster the team has size/D if needed at the 2 as well.  It would take a little creativity that I haven’t seen out of Cheeks with the current line up, but all in all it gives the team a lot of good fitting options.

          • Jan 3, 20142:25 pm
            by Max

            Good points about Hayward–he was the 2nd to last player on my list but I put him ahead of Afflalo in pure deference to age.  I’m not sold on him either but there are so few decent options.  
            Not sure about Bradley or Waiters.   I’d be a little leery of thinking Bradley has solved his jumper because he might just be having a hot month.   I guess a deal for either would be fine if there were other considerable considerations but I don’t think any draft picks will be forthcoming. 

  • Jan 2, 20145:34 pm
    by Darin

    Reply

    1. Growth.
    2.I agree with people about finding a rotation that works and sticking with it. A it of people are saying a new coach but he can only work with what he’s given.
    3. A big surprise would be making the playoffs, get to the second round and making it a series.

  • Jan 2, 20148:19 pm
    by grizz3741

    Reply

    It shouldnt take months to figure out playing a player out of position on a regular basis is a bad idea .. In fact, this should only happen occassionaly, due to sudden injuries or foul trouble. Smith at SF. Stuckey at PG. Prince at PF. Jmax at center. Singler at SG. Very concerned about the Detroit Pistons because their GM and HC don’t get this!

    • Jan 2, 20149:50 pm
      by Ozzie-Moto

      Reply

       
      Exactly ….. And the GM been creating rosters of “his” kind of guys regardless of roster balance or real skill level for years … I like Joe but have seen this flaw in his BB thinking for the last 5 or 6 years and have been saying he should have been fired for 4 or more.. Year after year his supporters say he only need one more year Honesty he really should retire. The pistons i am sure have made him rich and if he really cared he would fire himself for not getting the job done …. I like him as a player and for a few years as a GM but since it was obvious that his early years were part luck, part was good coaches (which he made sure we have not had for years now) …  I have no idea how he keeps getting a ridiculous pass that he would never get in any other situation.   Well it just may be at times the people of MIchigan are nice to dysfunctional fault ! 
      “Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results”.. Albert Einstein
       
       

      • Jan 2, 201410:11 pm
        by Tim Thielke

        Reply

        Not only is quoting that line a tired cliche, Einstein never said it. And you want to know why he didn’t? Because it’s a really, really stupid saying. By that logic, nobody should ever practice at anything. No, because again, the non-quote is friggin’ asinine.

        Apart from that, your comment has some merit. But you killed the whole thing at the end there and made it impossible to take the rest seriously, fallacy though that may be.

        • Jan 2, 201411:05 pm
          by Ozzie-Moto

          Reply

          Why can’t separate 2 things you read?  
          While after review i admit the authorship of the quote is in question, A smart person knows how to over look an errant detail to get to the real issues.   Tired and cliche are responses like yours, And unfortunately  what the team has been.  The local response (sports writers / owner etc ) have been unbelievable slow with regard to Joe D lack of quality stewardship of the team.  So while you might not like the quote why not STICKING TO THE TOPIC  but i guess you to busy trying to elevate yourself by fling petty words (that are not even pertinent) at the messenger, a cyber one at that….
          PS I responded to that post to point out your lack of civil discourse ..
              but it will my last responce to anything you post

          • Jan 2, 201411:10 pm
            by Tim Thielke

            If it were just about the authorship of the quote, it wouldn’t be so annoying. It’s the fact that the quote is completely idiotic and people love to spout it off to try to sound smart.

            People saying stupid things to look smart is one of my pet peeves. Such comments, along with prejudicial ones, are highly liable to draw my ire.

          • Jan 3, 20141:04 pm
            by Otis

            Tim, the quote isn’t idiotic at all. Doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results is very different from practicing. If you have a flaw in your mechanics (be it swinging a baseball bat, shooting a basketball, playing guitar) you make adjustments. If you practice free throws but never alter your mechanics, your free throws will all miss the same way. If you’re missing to the left, or they’re all long and clanking off the heel, you adjust. The quote speaks to a lack of adjustments, and it’s a good quote. You might be the first person I’ve ever seen attack that quote, and I’m a bit stunned. Times like these (and the time where you said you’d punch me in the face over nothing) I wonder where your head is at. The quote makes total sense.

          • Jan 3, 20141:22 pm
            by Tim Thielke

            As I said, idiocy and bigotry make me angry. Idiocy is not enough to make me want to hit someone, but it is enough to make me vent a bit. Bigotry, well, you can be surprised by my reaction, but I have no misgivings about it.

            As for the quote: Yes, in theory, doing the exact same thing in the exact same context with hopes of different results would be stupid. But we are never doing the exact same thing and we are definitely never in the exact same context.

            When I was unemployed, i applied to job after job after job in hopes of a different result. And it literally took hundreds of tries, but I got a different result. Because guess what, I wasn’t actually doing “exactly” the same thing. I was applying for different positions.

            In the same way, much as there are many legitimate gripes against Dumars, his problem isn’t doing the same thing over and over (he’s signing different coaches and players to different deals with different teammates in a changing league). That’s why the quote is dumb in this context. And that’s the same reason why it’s idiotic in every other context I have ever come across it. Persistence is a virtue to be lauded, not dismissed as “insanity”.

      • Jan 2, 201410:37 pm
        by Max

        Reply

        Right, Dumars is such a horrible GM and he should fire himself.   Don’t you realize he’d be at one of the top choices for nearly every GM opening in the league thereafter.  If you don’t believe me, take a look around the league and notice how many GMs who never accomplished anything continue to get jobs.   Just take a look at Billy King’s resume if you don’t think other teams will be chomping at the bit to hire Joe.   

        • Jan 2, 201410:54 pm
          by Tim Thielke

          Reply

          Without a doubt, he’d get a new job real soon. And then he could bring his fairly good small picture skills and his total lack of big picture vision or strategy to another team. I’m fine with that.

          • Jan 2, 201411:45 pm
            by Max

            Right, like when he handed one of the most complimentary teams ever that was much more than the sum of its parts and had some of the best chemistry the NBA has ever seen to Larry Brown and reportedly said to him and I’m paraphrasing, “You don’t understand.  You’ve never had a team like this where everyone is one the same page and brings the right attitude.”   The 2004 showed no big picture vision.   You are totally correct.   He didn’t learn anything from being on a team like the Bad Boys either I’m guessing.   
            You know, people can say what they want but I’m really of the opinion that the best GM of all time could strike out for a decade in a market like Detroit or really in any market other than L.A. and I’m not including the Clippers.   I’ll tell you something, if Monroe had a good jumper, the Pistons would be doing great and I don’t blame Joe for Monroe’s disappointing lack of improvement.     
            Dumars has had an incredible run of bad luck.  Let’s look at some of the signature bad moves.  
            Ben Gordon:  I didn’t personally like the Gordon signing but I never expected him to fall off a cliff as he’dbeen putting up Reggie Miller numbers his whole career before playing for the Pistons.   
            Dark Milicic:  Going into the draft people were comparing him to Bill Russell and asking if he should be drafted ahead of LeBron.  
            Charlie V:  Didn’t like this signing either but like Gordon he was about 90 percent worse than whatever I thought was his floor.  
            People have problems with all of Dumars free agent signing but I would point out that before Dumars the Pistons essentially NEVER made a great free agent signing and probably didn’t even make a good one.
            People have problems with Dumars making too many good draft picks that wind up flourishing for other teams but all that means to me is that he usually drafts well and his teams have often been too stocked for his coaches to give him much of a look at some of these players.  
            Dumars has not done a great job of picking coaches lately but he did pluck Carlyle out of the assistant coaching ranks and gave him his shot.  Maybe that success made him overly confident since he probably shouldn’t have given Curry a shot but it does show he can pick talent and he picked three great to good coaches in a row when the team was great.    
            Cheeks was an awful hire but in Dumars defense, it seems as if he and Gores didn’t think the team was ready to contend and didn’t want to pay big bucks for a great coach as a result–I did read reports that such was the case.   Well, the Pistons are not ready to contend so maybe Dumars does see a bigger picture than you think.   

          • Jan 3, 201412:00 am
            by Tim Thielke

            Which move did Dumars make in putting together that 2004 title team that was big picture oriented? When did he display an overall strategy? He made several good moves in a row. And it worked out. But there was no overarching game plan.

            You can see that in the way he tried to “retool” after the fact. Moves were not made in light of one another, they weren’t targeting a specific window, and he steadfastly refused to make major sacrifices in either the present or the future in order to strengthen the other.

            That is why he’d be a good guy to have around the front office, as the head of scouting or an assistant GM. We need small picture people, they’re very important. But it will take an inoordinate amount of luck for him to succeed when calling all the shots.

            I don’t have a problem with Dumars making mistakes. I have a problem with his lack of vision through the process.

            Do you really want a team run by someone who thinks that the mess the Pistons put on the floor for the last half-decade could “contend for the playoffs”? That requires some seriously poor evaluation skills. Do you really want a team run by someone who thinks that standing pat is a good strategy when “contending for the playoffs”? That is the worst time to do nothing because a move in either direction would help.

          • Jan 3, 201412:27 am
            by Max

            I pretty much disagree with everything you just said and you didn’t really support any of your opinions.  
            He didn’t make sacrifices or see things in terms of windows?   Well then why did he say he had seen enough after six straight trips to the conference finals and trade Chauncey Billups for Allen Iverson in a trade that both gave him a chance at a single season home run swing if Iverson worked and the cap room to completely change the roster if it didn’t.  Dumars even kept his word from years before when he broke up that team because he had said he would do it when the bigs declined and he did make the trade when the bigs declined.  That’s vision.   Even now, he seemingly continues to value bigs above all and has created too big of a roster but the Smith signing can still be validated by trading Monroe since the Smith signing is what gave him the flexibility to do it painlessly.  Unfortunately for the Pistons and Dumars the market for wings couldn’t be worse and it’s really the only thing the Pistons need. 
            We can argue about whether Dumars truly had his hands tied and knew it was coming regarding the death of Bill Davidson and the changing of ownership but I for one am a true believer.   Dumars made plenty of moves before that period and more recently but for an exceedingly long time during that period made no moves and fired no coaches which was quite out of character for him although some mistakenly now see that as his signature period.   
            Also, I could care less about quotes regarding the Pistons ability to contend for a playoff spot.  Do you really think he would talk about them being bad and not try to spin things?  And they can contend for a playoff spot and are in a situation where there is no reason they shouldn’t be trying to make the playoffs.
            Finally, this is not the worst time to nothing.   I’m admit I’m quite possibly wrong but I just don’t think any of the wings that come anywhere near Monroe’s trade value are available right now and it’s an impossible year to land high lottery picks so I think standing pat until the historical accident of this season’s draft combined with one of the shallowest markets for wings in NBA history changes.  I’m a patient fan.  I think in terms of championships.   This year and next year even don’t matter that much.  What matters is what kind of team the Pistons will feature when Drummond is 24-28 and beyond.     

          • Jan 3, 20141:40 am
            by Jacob

            Dumars is having a real hard time finding talent that fits right now. He is in fact finding talent though. It is hard to trade Monroe right now because it’s hard to find a good trade for him. Even harder to trade Smith because of his poor play and contract. Also because Drummond can be inconsistent still at times. So the best move would be to move Charlie, Stuckey, Bynum, Datome, Singler and or Jerebko for a 3 and D type player if all possible. I guess if you had to  throw in either KCP or Harrelson. It would have to really be worth it though. I like KCP and Harrleson, and wouldn’t want to trade them. Billups and Drummond are not being traded. So this will be interesting to see what happens over the next month and a half.
             

  • Jan 2, 20148:34 pm
    by jacob

    Reply

    I read on Espn insider that they may move Singler into the starting lineup at sg. Haha because 2 people playing out of position isn’t enough.

  • Jan 2, 201410:33 pm
    by CityofKlompton

    Reply

    1. More Andre Drummond.

    2. [expletive]. That Josh Smith signing really messed things up a bit. What the [expletive] do we do now, Tom? Where is Phil?

    3. Joe turns our scrubs into first round draft picks a la the early 2000s.

    • Jan 2, 201410:39 pm
      by Max

      Reply

      This is not the year for turning scrubs into first round picks.  Not happening.  

      • Jan 2, 201411:10 pm
        by CityofKlompton

        Reply

        A guy can dream, can’t he?

        • Jan 3, 20142:28 pm
          by Max

          Reply

          My bad.  Of course you can dream and the question you were answering was supposed to be a bold surprise. 

  • Jan 2, 201411:33 pm
    by DetroitP

    Reply

    Cracks me up how people can hate Joey D.  Yeah last few years sucked ass he did have some really good moves.  Being a pro GM is one of the hardest jobs in sports.  I can understand the frustration but acting like hes a complete moron, come on! look in the mirror…  Who’d we grab the “genius” Steve Mills?  I’d be pissed if we fired Joe.  We have a higher level of talent, you cant be at the top forever doesn’t work like that.  There are highs and lows, I have faith in the man.   Otis would trade Moose for some wack SF, C’MON MANNNNNN

    • Jan 3, 201412:08 am
      by Tim Thielke

      Reply

      Highs and lows happen. And I’m not bothered by Dumars’ mistakes. I’m bothered by his utter lack of a plan and his complete unawareness about smart team-building and about the caliber of players he has.

      This is sports we’re talking about. You have to accept that you’ll lose and probably lose often. But you have to have a gameplan. If you lose because others just outdid you or the bounces didn’t go your way, that’s manageable. If you lose because you put yourself in a position in which it was next to impossible to succeed, it’s time to be shown the door.

      • Jan 3, 20144:00 am
        by far north

        Reply

        Sorry, but this is simply idiotic–how do you put together a championship team that competes for multiple trips to the finals without a plan or a vision? Maybe it’s not one that you understand; or maybe having a “vision” is not really that important to success. It’s one thing to fault Dumars for mistakes in rebuilding, but not giving him credit for his successes as a GM severely weakens your argument. If you want to talk about realistic possibilities, what most likely happens if we fire Dumars is Gores hires someone less competent, we spiral further, and we also eventually lose Drummond. 

        • Jan 3, 201412:19 pm
          by Tim Thielke

          Reply

          Maybe he did have a plan, but then it was a highly unreliable like a movie villain’s absurdly complicated ruse that depends on every other character having all the exact right reactions at all the exact right moments. If so, thank your lucky stars for the one championship and get rid of him even more quickly because that will never, ever come together again.

          Consider that, in order to make that team, Dumars had to have 5 moves come together better than anyone could possibly have hoped: Billups and Wallace had to way exceed expectations. Stack for Rip was a smart move, but a risky one, and it turned out as perfectly as one could imagine. Dumars couldn’t plan on Prince falling to him out of the lottery, but even given that he did, Prince turned out better sooner than anyone imagined. And Sheed was the cherry on top. It was a great move with so much potential to backfire. But not only did it work, it worked instantly, which was what Detroit needed. Because if it just took a couple months for everyone to figure out their roles with Sheed around, the Pistons wouldn’t have won it all and their ruin would look a lot more like the Suns’ than the Celtics’.

          None of those moves were predicated on one another. They were 5 independent home runs. Were they great moves? Yes. Was that team a ton of fun? Yes. Does that speak to Dumars’ ability to make good moves in a vacuum? Yes. Is that a dependable, sustainable game plan? Not even close!

          So why do you think a different GM would get rid of Drummond?

          • Jan 3, 20141:01 pm
            by far north

            I think the chances of another GM doing better in the next three years are much less likely than the chances of another GM doing poorer. And that does not bode well for our ability to hold on to Drummond, who certainly can force his way out like Chris Paul, Carmelo Anthony, Dwight Howard, Lebron James and other stars have who were under contract for small market teams.

          • Jan 3, 20142:31 pm
            by Max

            I also think it’s possible the Pistons lose Drummond if a new GM comes in because new GMs tend to clean house and think they will get no credit for anyone the GM they are replacing acquired.  Hiring a new GM is often the same as starting over from scratch and the first year in such cases tends to be about getting rid of everyone rather than improving. 

    • Jan 3, 201412:09 am
      by Max

      Reply

      Thank you!  Somebody gets it.   Dumars put every single piece in place when the Pistons had one of the greatest sustained runs the NBA has ever seen and anyone who thought there weren’t going to be some lean years following that are just not grounded in reality.   Anyone remember the Bulls’ next five years after Jordan?   Anyone remember the Celtics in the fifteen years or so following Bird’s retirement?   Personally, I’m already waiting with forks and knives for Duncan to retire so everyone can see how great the Spurs’ organization is without their bedrock.  

      • Jan 3, 201412:24 am
        by Tim Thielke

        Reply

        One of the greatest sustained runs the NBA has ever seen?

        The Pistons had a nice run (win totals of 50, 50, 54, 54, 64, 53, 59) for sure, but it was hardly an all-timer. Those would include the Russel Celtics, the Jordan Bulls, the Bird Celtics, pretty much the entire history of the Lakers, the Duncan Spurs, and not a lot else.

        The 2000s Pistons put together about as much of an all-time run as the KG-Pierce-Allen Celtics. Except those Celtics actually dismantled right.

        • Jan 3, 201412:35 am
          by Max

          Reply

          The Pistons had a better run than the Celtics who didn’t do anything like getting to the conference finals for six straight years with playoff appearances on both sides before and after.   I once tried to really figure it out and while you are right about the Celtics, Lakers and Bulls I think I came to the conclusion that the 04 group had the 8th best run of contending of all time.   Maybe you don’t think that should constitute one of the best runs ever but I would dispute that and especially because those Pistons didn’t have Magic, Bird, Russell, Jordan or anything even approaching them.  In my opinion that elevates their accomplishment and the lion’s share of credit goes to Dumars since the credit was as divided as any group ever that contended over a long period.    

          • Jan 3, 201412:08 pm
            by Tim Thielke

            In terms of absolute advancement, the Pistons’ run was slightly better (playoffs, ECF, champs, finals, ECF, ECF, ECF, playoffs) compared to (champs, 2nd round, finals, 2nd round, ECF, playoffs). On the other hand, those were also the down years of the league (between the Jordan era and the James era).

            Consider that in the year Detroit won (2004), there were 6 (!) only time all-stars. That’s right, those were the only days ever when the likes of Jamaal Magloire, Kenyon Martin, Sam Cassel, Andrei Kirilenko, Michael Redd, and Ron Artest were considered among the league’s best and brightest.

            So you could rate either run as better than the other. The Pistons were more consistent, but they were never as scary when everything was falling their way (chemistry, health, etc). But they were incredibly similar. Both were fast tracked rebuilds, propelled by a couple huge trades that got a championship early and then stayed scary for years but were slowly tapering off. And both played in LeBron’s narrative like the Bad Boys did Jordan’s.

          • Jan 3, 20142:13 pm
            by Max

            I know others say make the claim that the early and mid 2000s were somehow down years but I utterly reject that notion.   For me, the Jordan years were actually the down years and here’s my argument:
            1.  The Jordan Bulls never beat a truly great team in the playoffs other than maybe the 1991 Pistons and Lakers who were running out of gas and not quite ready respectively.  The other candidates would include the Utah Jazz who only made the finals twice with Stockton and Malone playing together for nearly 20 years and I would say they snuck into the finals those two years since they never would have sniffed beating Magic’s Lakers or Shaq’s Lakers once Kobe was no longer a teenager.  Olajuwon’s Rockets were clearly the 2nd best team of the Jordan era but Jordan never played them and I personally think the Rockets would have beaten the Bulls since they had no one to defend Olajuwon and……..Ewing’s Knicks gave Jordan’s Bulls the toughest time but those teams never featured a true 2nd all star although Starks and Oakley did make the team in the manner of the players you were trying to say weren’t true all stars in 04 like Magloire–although I disagree with you as much as humanly possible regarding Artest and Cassell and disagree with you quite a bit regarding Kirelenko and Redd.    
            2.  Jordan did beat Magic’s Lakers in 91 but as I said earlier those Lakers weren’t quite ready and were going to get a lot better in subsequent years if Magic hadn’t prematurely retired.   Now Magic finished 2nd in MVP voting in 91 and his Lakers were still learning to play without Kareem and were reliant on two very young bigs in Vlade Divac and Elden Campbell who were going to get better every year for many years after 91.  
            Jordan beats this team in 91 and then, Magic, a top 2 MVP candidate of that year walks away for reasons that had nothing to do with basketball.   Imagine if Duncan or Shaq had walked away in 2000 and ask yourself how many titles the one who was left would have won over the next decade since there was a period when those two players combined for nearly every single title over the course of a decade.  
            It is worth pointing out that Magic never lost to the same team twice in the playoffs and only Moses Malone beat him twice on different franchises as a player. 
            3. Before Jordan’s Bulls dominated the 90s the 80s featured a few teams that I think were much better than any team that played in the 90s proper.   Magic’s Lakers, Bird’s Celtics and Moses’ 76s were absolutely stocked with all time greats in a way no 90s team approached and Isiah’s Pistons beat Jordan’s Bulls more times than they lost to them so I dislike your comparison regarding the 04 group in relation to James since the Pistons didn’t frustrate James year after year until finally losing to him one time when they were starting to fall apart.  
            After Jordan’s Bulls dominated the 90s at least two teams emerged that were much better than any team team Jordan ever beat and they were Shaq’s Lakers and Duncan’s Spurs.  
            4.  It just seems pretty obvious to me that although Jordan was arguably the best player of all time his championship years occurred largely during an era when no truly great contender other than the Olajuwon Rockets he never faced was around to oppose him.   I believe that you have to consider who somebody has beaten when judging their greatness and all of the 80s and 2000s teams I have mentioned benefit from having beaten other great teams but the Bulls can’t make that claim and their Achilles Heal of playing poor starting centers was never really tested by anyone other than Patrick Ewing who didn’t have a lot of help and his team still consistently pushed Jordan’s Bulls more than anyone so what would Shaq, Olajuwon or Duncan and Robinson have done to them? 
            I’d also disagree that the James era is somehow some superior era.  Duncan’s Spurs nearly beat them last year and they aren’t nearly as good as they were during the supposed down years when, in my belief, they would have trounced the Heat.   Same goes for Shaq’s Lakers, those KG, Pierce, Allen, Rondo Celtics and maybe even those 04 Pistons.   The Heat have holes in their roster and the fact that they just won two titles in a row seems to me to have a lot to do with the absence of a truly great team to take advantage of those holes.   Before calling this the James era and acting like the time between now and when Jordan was winning you might want to consider that just three seasons ago, during the supposed James’ era, Dirk Nowitski and the Mavs beat James and the Heat to win a title and Dirk has only gotten to the finals in anomalous years when Shaq wasn’t in the west (Dirk’s first trip to the finals featured a loss to Shaq’s Heat) and fluky things happened in the playoffs to get them past Duncan’s Spurs–a team they usually lose to except when there are injuries or terrible calls by the refs.  
            In conclusion, the Shaq/Duncan era was superior to either the Jordan or James era for two main reasons. Their best teams would have beaten their best teams and they had each other to measure themselves by. 

      • Jan 3, 20141:16 pm
        by CityofKlompton

        Reply

        Dumars made a string of moves, many of which seemed minuscule at the time but ended being a big piece of later, bigger moves, that all worked out perfectly. It was an unprecedented run for a GM, much less an inexperienced one at that.
        However, since then he has done the complete opposite. A couple terrible moves, a few seemingly minor moves that turned out perfectly bad, and he hasn’t been able to dig the team out of it yet. I don’t necessarily think he should definitely be fired or retained, but to say this team’s front office could use a fresh perspective is completely reasonable at this point.

  • Jan 2, 201411:52 pm
    by I HATE FRANK

    Reply

     Just to shoot the breeze
    ..
    Joe gets a phone call from the Chicago Bulls, they are interested in Monroe…they offer derrick rose and jimmy butler for Monroe, Stuckey and charlie…. what do you do?

    • Jan 3, 201412:03 am
      by Tim Thielke

      Reply

      WTF? You take it and figure out who slipped Forman a truckload of acid. And then you send that person the best damn thank you basket ever made.

      • Jan 3, 201412:11 am
        by Max

        Reply

        I don’t know.  I wouldn’t touch Rose right now.  He may never be good again and he’s got a big contract.   Even if he came back and had some success I’d feel like I was walking on a tight rope that could snap at any moment.  

    • Jan 3, 201412:04 am
      by Tim Thielke

      Reply

      And then, in case the case of stupidity is contagious, you inquire whether LeBron is available for Smith.

  • Jan 3, 201412:00 pm
    by Jacob

    Reply

    Despite the team’s recent slump, David Mayo of MLive.com doesn’t think the Pistons will trade Greg Monroe anytime soon, since they’ve set up their cap so that they can afford to keep Monroe, Andre Drummond, and Josh Smith for at least a couple more seasons.

    • Jan 3, 20141:09 pm
      by Otis

      Reply

      I’ve been saying this for a while. Safe to expect no trades and the slow painful death of the franchise.

      • Jan 3, 20141:57 pm
        by Smitty

        Reply

        I think it wouldn’t be the worst thing to keep Monroe. He’s a good young big. The rotations will have to change. I think they should start Singler and bring Moose off the bench. The big 3 should only play together about 5 min per game. What would really annoy me if Joe doesn’t at least try to move Stuckey Bynum Charlie or Jerebko. I still think Joe wants Rondo. So if that is the case and Rondo comes back strong, we can make a move centered around Jennings and Monroe for Rondo, Wallace and whoever Boston throws in. Olynyk, Green, Sullinger, or a pick.

    • Jan 3, 20145:25 pm
      by Max

      Reply

      Thanks for the link.  I like David Mayo’s take in general on the Pistons. 

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