↓ Login/Logout ↓
Schedule/Results
↓ Roster ↓
Salaries
↓ Archives ↓
↓ About ↓

Pistons Hold Off Late Knicks Run To Pick Up Needed Win

New York Knicks 86 Final

Recap | Box Score

92 Detroit Pistons
Greg Monroe, PF 36 MIN | 6-8 FG | 4-4 FT | 11 REB | 1 AST | 0 STL | 0 BLK | 5 TO | 16 PTS | +10Monroe’s offense was desperately needed int his one, but he didn’t assert himself often enough and his D was the worst I’ve seen from him this year. Bargnani went off on him early and whenever Anthony had success, it was typically because he was able to force Monroe to switch onto him.
Josh Smith, SF 41 MIN | 7-19 FG | 3-5 FT | 5 REB | 4 AST | 1 STL | 0 BLK | 1 TO | 19 PTS | +9Smith was once again way too eager to throw up long jumpers, but he shut down Carmelo and that was exactly what Detroit needed.
Andre Drummond, C 36 MIN | 6-7 FG | 1-5 FT | 11 REB | 1 AST | 2 STL | 3 BLK | 3 TO | 13 PTS | -6Drummond is starting to look like the most consistent player in the league. His play every night is the same. On offense, the Pistons don’t run anything for him but he regularly bails them out with good positioning to catch lobs or beautiful putbacks. On defense, he fouls way too much and doesn’t yet have the best instincts, but he hustles and comes up with several big plays. Chalk him up as pretty much a nightly 12 and 12 while hitting about 80% of his field goals and 20% of his free throes.
Brandon Jennings, PG 27 MIN | 1-3 FG | 0-0 FT | 0 REB | 7 AST | 0 STL | 1 BLK | 1 TO | 2 PTS | +3Jennings missed a lot of time in this one because he was ailing. If Bynum were available, he should have just sat out the game. Jennings was invisible for most of his playing time. Get better soon Jennings, I don’t love your trigger-happiness but Detroit really could have used your floor spacing while the Knicks stormed back from 15 down to a 5 point gap.
Kentavious Caldwell-Pope, SG 29 MIN | 4-12 FG | 2-2 FT | 4 REB | 0 AST | 1 STL | 0 BLK | 0 TO | 13 PTS | +12Pope’s shot looked a lot better in this one even if he still only hit 4 of 12. The next step is to work on his shot selection. He took several shots from waaaay beyond the arc or just inside of it. Those are low value attempts. His man-to-man D wasn’t as good as it’s been in other games either, but his help and rotations were crisp. Pope looks like he may take a while to put everything together, but he has a lot of very valuable skills.
Luigi Datome, SF 5 MIN | 1-2 FG | 0-0 FT | 0 REB | 1 AST | 1 STL | 0 BLK | 2 TO | 3 PTS | -3For his couple minutes, Datome looked exactly as I expected going into the season. If he could extrapolate those stats to 20-25 mpg, Datome could be a very valuable contributor in Detroit this year. But that defense was awful and there was no way he was going to get 20-25 minutes.
Kyle Singler, SF 23 MIN | 2-4 FG | 0-0 FT | 2 REB | 0 AST | 0 STL | 0 BLK | 0 TO | 5 PTS | +3Singler didn’t produce much, but I loved his activity around loose balls. And he did a very good job on defense, especially when he rotated onto Melo.
Peyton Siva, PG 11 MIN | 0-1 FG | 0-0 FT | 2 REB | 0 AST | 0 STL | 0 BLK | 1 TO | 0 PTS | +4Siva didn’t look talented enough to be on an NBA court, he was sloppy, and he fought with teammates for boards. If he wants to ever carve out a niche in the league, Siva will have to play some much headier ball because I don’t see anything else he has to offer.
Rodney Stuckey, SG 31 MIN | 8-14 FG | 5-5 FT | 2 REB | 5 AST | 1 STL | 0 BLK | 2 TO | 21 PTS | -2Make no mistake, I don’t want to see Stuckey shoot 20 footers with 4 hands in his face ever again. But against New York, he hit multiple such shots. His offense and Smith’s defense are the reasons Detroit got a win. Not bad for a guy who has taken as much flak in recent years as Stuckey has had to absorb.
Maurice Cheeks
I still don’t like his rotations, but Cheeks made a very smart move putting in Singler for Drummond at the end. No need to allow a hack-a-Drummond strategy to ever even be an option. Given how few shooters the Pistons employ, Cheeks needs to drum it into their heads that,w hen on the floor, they need to be beyond the 3 point arc unless they are actively carrying out a play. The spacing down the stretch was abysmal.

One Thing We Saw

  1. There were no egregious calls, but nearly everything questionable went the Pistons’ way. They were fortunate to come up with this win. But wins often involve a bit of fortune. They’ll take it: 4-6 sounds way better than 3-7.

80 Comments

  • Nov 20, 20132:15 am
    by Brandon Knight

    Reply

    I don’t know why they give it to Smith when the shot is winding down… he is gonna shoot a three and miss it, DUH! 

    • Nov 20, 20132:17 am
      by anacaniwelk

      Reply

      Smith’s our best player.

      • Nov 20, 201310:36 am
        by MIKEYDE248

        Reply

        Even if he is the best play, he isn’t the best shooter.  He needs to play within himself and stick with his higher percentage shots.  Most of the shots he took at the end of the game almost cost the Pistons the game.

    • Nov 20, 20136:01 am
      by Jens

      Reply

      Yep, I totally agree. Those were horrible PG decisions. Giving Smith the ball on perimeter with the shot clock winding down never is an appropriate option. Otherwise Smith would have shot like 7-15 for the game.   

    • Nov 20, 201311:54 am
      by jamesjones_det

      Reply

      If the shot clock is under 10 and JS has the ball on the perimeter it’s a guaranteed pump fake and then shot.  Every time I’ve watched JS that’s been the case (even in ATL).  You would think after 10 years he would have learned he’s not a good hand in face jump shooter but he just doesn’t seem to care.

  • Nov 20, 20132:16 am
    by anacaniwelk

    Reply

    Brandon Jennings 7 assists, 1 turnover….while being sick. His assist to turnover ratio is excellent.  So underrated.  Drummond, as always, missing free throws and completely lost defensively. 

    • Nov 20, 20133:51 am
      by jg22

      Reply

      Are you joking? Drummond’s defense was very good tonight. Maybe you were confusing Monroe’s inability to guard his man as Drummonds fault somehow? idk becuse his D was good tonight

    • Nov 20, 20136:04 am
      by Jens

      Reply

      I think the grading on Jennings is a little strange as well. He had a couple of very good pick and rolls with Drummond… 

      • Nov 20, 20138:17 am
        by Steve K

        Reply

        Yeah, I thought this was one of Jennings’ better games. Who cares if he goes off for 20. He got others involved and didn’t rush anything.

    • Nov 20, 20133:30 pm
      by Brigs

      Reply

      How could u say Drummond was lost defensivly, 2 steals 3 blocks and held barganani to only 16 pts on a bunch of shots. He shouldn’t be guarding him anyways but with Monroe’s inability to move his feet on defense he pretty much had too or we might have got lit up at the 3 pt line again.

  • Nov 20, 20133:16 am
    by Mel

    Reply

    Hey without Smith Shooting three’s we wouldn’t have been in half of the games they played in. With all of the other things he brings to the table I don;t mine feeding him a few bones during a game. At least he’s shooting them in rhythm and in decent spots. For Jennings to be sick he still got us 7 assist. I right now I’m pretty happy where the team is. I knew the first ten games would be a test considering 8 new players ,new coach and injuries during the preseason. 4-6 is not a bad start considering.
    Now look at New York, Toronto, Cleveland, Washington, New Jersey, Whats there excuse ? I gave up on Stuckey last year and was pretty upset when Cheeks was talking him up this summer, but Cheeks has done something right cause Stuck only plays like this during the end of the season for about 10 games then he’s back to being a disappointment. Pistons are competing now and I can now watch a game and feel the team is going to put forth an effort. Yes we still got a ways to go but I’m liking what I’m seeing now as compared to the previous seasons watching guys not motivated or being angry when a play goes bad. There’s passion on this team now and J Smoove is one of the guys bringing it. GO Pistons

  • Nov 20, 20133:25 am
    by JGoplay

    Reply

    I think Jennings is being graded a little unfairly. I know he loves to shoot the ball, but him running the offense is infinitely better than anyone else on this roster. NY made their comeback when Rodney was running the point. I know him getting hot helped, but that was the only offense. no one was moving, it was just one on one basketball. luckily stuckey was hitting shots (i wouldn’t count on this too much..or at all). Otherwise this game should’ve been a loss for us. 

  • Nov 20, 20133:52 am
    by jg22

    Reply

    An F for Siva, and you don’t see anything he brings to the game? You should pay closer attention to his on ball defense next time because it is pretty darn good.
    A stark contrast to the Laker game where Blake went wherever he wanted

    • Nov 20, 20133:55 am
      by jg22

      Reply

      If only we could combine Siva’s defense with Jennings playmaking…Actually we can if we trade Monroe and Jennings for Rondo lol. Literally though, Rondo gives you great defense and playmaking and is a high % shooter. He would be a perfect fit here….
       
      I like Jennings though too. Much upgrade from Knight. But if there’s any chance to get Rondo I’d do that deal in a second

      • Nov 20, 20134:06 am
        by domnick

        Reply

        rondo is a good pg.. however, i think what rondo doesn’t have is being a Clutch… Jennings is a clutch player… 
         
        if we trade monroe… we need a wing guy like Klay Thompson… thats a trade i wanna have.. this will open up our inside-outside game

      • Nov 20, 201311:59 am
        by jamesjones_det

        Reply

        With Rondo on this team who makes a jump shot?  Anyone?  Rondo only has a high % because most of his shots are in close with other spreading the floor for him, that doesn’t exist here.  Jennings isn’t a great shooter but I would take him over Rondo with this team makeup.
         
        Monroe and Jennings is way to much for Rondo anyway.

  • Nov 20, 20134:02 am
    by CF4714

    Reply

    Really? Some of these grades are laughable. I thought Jennings played a hell of a game. He took 3 shots and got his teammates involved. You ask him to take more shots and when he does, you’ll probably give him crap for that too.
    Also, Siva filled in well, he didn’t force any shots, played defense, and hustled. I think you, Tim Thielke, deserve an F for your grades.

    • Nov 20, 20134:13 am
      by domnick

      Reply

      he probably needs to have ailment just to be more passive :P

  • Nov 20, 20134:16 am
    by @GPMasters

    Reply

    Phew… a much needed win. Stuckey was the catalyst, he has improved so much this season (so far). His trade value is rising right now.
    Feel like an F for Siva is extremely harsh, he was a terrier on D, worked his socks off battling through screens.

    • Nov 20, 20136:16 am
      by Jens

      Reply

      Yes, I agree. An F for Siva is totally off the charts. Almost as much off the charts as an A- to Drummond.
      Unlike some of the earlier games Drummond is no total disappointment anymore, but I´d hoped he would be further advanced in his development by now. His defense is not good at all. I agree that he is a very TALENTED Defender with the potential to block 5-8 shots any given night, but he is completely lacking the fundamentals right now. He is biting for shot fakes, he is gambling in the wrong moments (Smith is a good example for gambling in the right moments, although it makes your pulse race sometimes) and the worst of all is, that he is not boxing out nor is he closing the baseline.
      That free throw shooting thing is mostly a mental Problem. He is capable of hitting them mechanically. I don´t know what the Pistons pay their shot doctors for…..  

  • Nov 20, 20136:48 am
    by Rich

    Reply

    You’re flat-out wrong about the Singler for Drummond swap.
     
    At the point it was made, the Knicks had only two team fouls, and there was only 30 seconds left until hack-a-Drummond would have meant free throw and the ball.
     
    Hack-a-Drummond would never have been an option for the Knicks.  Mo took out the guy who was playing best in the 4th quarter for no good reason whatsoever.

  • Nov 20, 20138:19 am
    by I HATE FRANK

    Reply

    LOL@ bashing Smith shooting … he is taking clean looks at the basket…. im okay with him shooting 3′s with his feet set…that does not bother me…
    its the dribble, dribble, step back 20 footers…i cant stand…..
    but we need Smith to take open looks especially when he is playing SF…
    I can live with 2-5,2-6, or 3-7 if they are good looks

    • Nov 20, 201310:32 am
      by MIKEYDE248

      Reply

      His shot selection was very good most of the game, up until the last few minutes.  Stuckey was in the zone and couldn’t miss a shot, but for some reason Smith decided that he needed to take the next 4 or 5 shots all in very bad situations and of course missed them all.

    • Nov 20, 201311:02 am
      by Tim Thielke

      Reply

      I’m all for Smith taking wide open 3s. But he’s a bad enough shooter that if there is someone on him or he’s inside the arc, he should never be shooting long balls.

      • Nov 20, 20137:46 pm
        by frankie d

        Reply

        Disagree vehemently!  There is a reason smith is open so often for 3 pointers: opponents WANT him to take that shot.  Especially coach woodson who tried like hell to stop him from shooting 3 pointers.  Even if he is momentarily hot, every stat from his long nba csreer says he will eventually cool off.  Good defensive teams – and some bad ones – bait bad shooters into taking the shots they want them to take.

        • Nov 21, 201312:33 am
          by Tim Thielke

          Reply

          His poor three point shooting includes a lot of non-wide open attempts. He does well enough when uncovered. Let teams dare him to shoot them. It will sometimes go their way, but more often the Pistons’ way.

  • Nov 20, 20138:28 am
    by Pistons87

    Reply

    I enjoyed the win last night but Greg’s defense was some of the worst I’ve ever seen.  I’m not in the trade Monroe crowd but I’m not sure we should give him Max money if there’s not some improvement on that end.  He’s a liability on defense at both big spots.  At Center his one on one defense is OK against back to the basket types except when they’re longer or quicker but his help defense and rotations are horrible, plus he’s not a shot blocking threat so teams constantly drive to basket when he’s back there.  At PF there are quicker players so he gets beat off the dribble a ton, the bonus to him at PF is that Andre as C defends the paint and rotates better simply because he’s so much more athletic then Moose.
    The thing that drives me nuts with his D is when he loses his man and then his man get the ball on the perimeter.  He’ll hustle to recover but he’s not thinking about the next move, he’s only thinking about closing the gap, invariably his man just puts the ball on the floor and blows right past him because he hasn’t put himself in a defensive position.  His D could be so much better with better technique but it doesn’t look like he’s improving on that end at all.

  • Nov 20, 20139:27 am
    by I HATE FRANK

    Reply

    i cant lie i get a little bummed when i look at the box scores and see that Drummond has less than 15rebs … 
    im i alone?

    • Nov 20, 20139:58 am
      by Javell

      Reply

      I agree i want dre to lead the league in rebounding but hopfully he can. But greg steals some of his rebounds 

      • Nov 20, 201310:15 am
        by I HATE FRANK

        Reply

        its just me being selfish…

  • Nov 20, 20139:39 am
    by PistonManiac

    Reply

    Peyton deserved a better grade than that. His on ball defense was better than Bynum and Billups combined this season
    Once, again, Smith almost cost the Pistons this game. At one point in the game, the team was doing well then Smith returned the Knicks started chipping away at the lead. Smith shot selection is atrocious coupled with the fact he has no handles or an intermediate game. I can’t picture him on a nba championship team as a starting small forward. I thought he deserved a D+

  • Nov 20, 20139:45 am
    by Lee

    Reply

    I’m fed up with the Siva bashing.  F?  Seriously?  Most DBBers commenting on Siva agree he played really good defense in his limited minutes.  David Mayo article on MLive points out “Cheeks even used the rookies Siva and Caldwell-Pope together to start the fourth quarter, in a small lineup with Stuckey, Singler and Andre Drummond. The Pistons stretched the lead by five points with that group, with Stuckey doing all the scoring while the Knicks shot 0 of 4.”  So he took an ill-advised 3.  He traveled once.  If  KCP, whom I like, fails to score multiple times he is still credited with having the courage to shoot and for playing good defense.  But Siva takes one shot, misses, and travels and he is an F for his FIRST eleven minutes in a game that counts instead of pre-season.  What’s up with that, dude?
     

    • Nov 20, 201310:18 am
      by I HATE FRANK

      Reply

      Siva was in a tough position, he was really expecting to play….but stepped in right away…
      Travelling happens, bad shots happen…but its more about not playing scared….
       

    • Nov 20, 201310:38 am
      by Huddy

      Reply

      Siva was playing on ball defense against a Knicks team who’s PGs consisted of Beno Udrith and Prignioni, he asded nothing on offense,  and if you watched him play he was out of place and in the way rebounding.  playing better defense than Chauncey and Bynum is no miracle.  Doesn’t deserve an F?  Maybe not its not like he lost 8 TOs or anything, but how great of a grade do you get for stopping below average point guards on a team dominated by its Forward for 10 mins?  The Knicks PGs combined for 8 shot attempts the whole game.  Maybe he deserves a D-…woo hoo.

    • Nov 20, 201310:53 am
      by Tim Thielke

      Reply

      He didn’t have a lot of play to go on, but when he was on the court, he added nothing. If he’d been a complete nonfactor for 3-5 minutes, I’d give him a D. But for 11 minutes? He’s gotta make at least one or two worthwhile plays in that much time to rise above F status in my books.

      • Nov 20, 201312:39 pm
        by frankie d

        Reply

        Defense doesnt count?

        • Nov 20, 20133:05 pm
          by Tim Thielke

          Reply

          If I thought his defense was really bad, I would have made mention of it in his box. If I thought it was really good, I would have as well and would have raised his grade. My take on Siva’s D was that it was unremarkable so I chose not to remark upon it. For a further explanation, see my response to Lee right below.

      • Nov 20, 201312:43 pm
        by Lee

        Reply

        Let me repeat.  Siva was good on defense.  On offense he made  a couple of mistakes.  I agree with Kathy Clater that you and many other people have been far more generous to KCP when making shooting mistakes, being in the wrong place, etc., etc., etc.  To say he does not belong in the NBA based on 11 minutes in his first game goes far and beyond just giving him a low rating and speaks of some kind of prejudice–against Louisville, against Siva personally, against pure college point guards attempting to make the adjustment to the NBA or against people drafted in the late second round.  I don’t know what your bias is but it exists nevertheless.  If you don’t like him as a player, that’s your business but to conclude that he doesn’t belong in the NBA based on eleven minutes is just wrong! 

        • Nov 20, 20132:57 pm
          by Tim Thielke

          Reply

          I don’t like Siva (I don’t dislike him either–I just don’t think he is NBA caliber) but I am more than willing for him to prove me wrong. 11 minutes is not enough to prove me right or wrong, but I can only grade what he did, which was essentially nothing.

          His defense was not very good. Prigioni actually had a decent game and didn’t slow down any when Siva covered him (1-2, 3 points, 2 rebounds, 2 assists, and drew two fouls from Siva in those 11 minutes). And I really disliked his snatching a rebound out of Monroe’s hands. That’s just not good team basketball.

          I never claimed Siva definitely won’t cut it in the NBA But I feel no need to hide my doubts that he will and I stand by my comment that he will have to do better than he did in this game in order to ever make a non-injury-shortened rotation.

        • Nov 20, 20134:24 pm
          by Huddy

          Reply

          Everyone is “prejudiced” against  the skill level of people drafted in the late second round…that’s why they fall to the late second round.  No one gives them much of a chance to make it in the NBA and most of them don’t.  It makes far more sense to doubt Sivas potential than to over inflate it.

    • Nov 20, 20132:27 pm
      by sebastian

      Reply

      And, the traveling call was highly questionable. I like that Mo’ displayed confidence in putting Siva on the floor. L. Frank would had never put Siva on the floor, during the 2nd quarter of the 10 game of the season.
      The kid played well for the moments that he was on the floor.

  • Nov 20, 201310:01 am
    by apa8ren9

    Reply

    Im always amazed at how two people can watch the same thing and have such diverging opinions.   In the case of Jennings I thought he played a good game considering the circumstances.  The way the game was going I was upset that he had to come out.  I thought the Pistons really struggled when anyone other than Jennings ran the point.  When Siva was in he got them in the offense too slow and you could really see he was thinking rather than playing.   The one or two times they let Pope run the point was a disaster, and even though Stuckey had a good game there was the one on one vibe instead of a smooth offense which allowed NY to get back in it.   In any event Im glad they won and I like the way this is headed.  The Pistons have raised their talent level and have the ability to compete on a nightly basis.   But what you are seeing now are the glaring warts.   They can be fixed, but as far as personnel changes go you have to let the season play out to see if players get better.   Also as far as coaching goes you have to play the games to see if Cheeks can get the message across.   I dont think they are far off at all from being a 45-46 win team with the current group.

    • Nov 20, 201310:59 am
      by Tim Thielke

      Reply

      I have no problem conceding that Jennings did a better job than Siva. Jennings’ poor grade was largely based on the fact that when I looked at his stat line, I thought “What? He played 27 minutes? I could have sworn it was more like 17.” If it’s that easy to forget that a guy was on the floor, he probably won’t get high marks from me.

      • Nov 20, 201311:40 am
        by Derek AKA Redeemed

        Reply

        seven assists in 17 minutes would have REALLY been something!

        • Nov 20, 201312:12 pm
          by Tim Thielke

          Reply

          True. I probably undersold his passing because I was distracted by his Harden-caliber D.

  • Nov 20, 201310:13 am
    by I HATE FRANK

    Reply

    Pope Defensive remind me of Shumperts

  • Nov 20, 201310:19 am
    by MIKEYDE248

    Reply

    As much Stuckey bashing as I did the last couple of years and all summer, he had better watch out or he might play himself into a starting postion.  It’s nice to see him play more like we thought he would after his rookie year.  I’m not sure if it’s something he can continue for a whole season or if it’s just because it a contract year for him.  Hopefully if he keeps it up, it will increase his trade value.
    I cringed so many times when I saw the shots he was taking yesterday, but was surprised that most of them were going in.  Too bad Smith thought he could do the same thing later in the game and started cranking up bad shot after bad shot, but unfortunately none of his were going in.  I never understand why teams stop going to the hot hand or was it just Smith trying to be the hero?

  • Nov 20, 201310:32 am
    by lotterybound14

    Reply

    Trade Moose to Golden State for Klay Thompson. They’re not going to want to give him a max deal after paying Curry and AI, so it makes sense for Detroit to do so and still have the ability to pay Drummond when hes up for an extension. Detroit rounds out a Jennings/Smith/Drummond/Thompson core while Golden State has Curry/AI/Monroe/ and maybe Lee, unless hes moved.
     
    The deal works wonders for the Pistons because it forces Jennings to move the ball around the perimeter and puts Smith in the post. Moose isnt going to get any better. Get what you can for him now.

    • Nov 20, 201310:48 am
      by @GPMasters

      Reply

      Pah, Klay Thompson and what else? Nowhere near to equal value.

      • Nov 20, 201310:49 am
        by @GPMasters

        Reply

        Also – “Get what you can for him now” … what do you think he is, some kind of scrub?

  • Nov 20, 201310:33 am
    by James Hunter

    Reply

    Im starting to think you dont even watch the games, and if you do then what are you looking at? Pope stuck GREAT man to man Defense on the 6th man of the year, He was 2 of 9 from 3.. Singler on the other hand was terrible in rotation and man to man. He still taking dumb fouls at times we didnt need. He’s not knocking down the open shot. Im ready to see a drop in his minutes. You rip Jennings for WHATEVER he does. He could of went out there and shot us out the game WHILE PLAYING SICK, but he didnt and got 7 Asst and 1 turnover. What more can he do?

    • Nov 20, 201311:54 am
      by Tim Thielke

      Reply

      “Pope stuck GREAT man to man Defense on the 6th man of the year”

      You mean the guy who easily had his best offensive game of the season last night? J.R. put up 18 points on 47% shooting. For the rest of the year, he has averaged 10 points on 23% shooting.

      Pardon me if I’m not blown away by Pope holding Smith to 22% from three in a game where Detroit’s terrible perimeter D held the Knicks to 25% from three.

  • Nov 20, 201310:42 am
    by PistonManiac

    Reply

    I think the decision will come to moving either Smith or Monroe. Something has to give.

    • Nov 20, 201311:14 am
      by MIKEYDE248

      Reply

      Yeah, it’s a pretty bad thing to have 3 guys getting double doubles a night.

  • Nov 20, 201310:59 am
    by Danny

    Reply

    Kind of ironic when stuck dominates the ball and gets us the win, he gets more gripe about his play than when Jennings does that and we lose.  Just an observation that I’ve noticed.

  • Nov 20, 201311:17 am
    by Raphael

    Reply

    Harsh grade for Jennings.  The man is sick and still pumps out 7 assist. I think that deserves a much higher grade. I’m just glad he didn’t force up a bunch of ill advised shots. 

  • Nov 20, 201311:24 am
    by Kathy Clater

    Reply

    I think you graded Siva too harshly too, but what really incensed me was the stupid comment that he doesn’t belong in the NBA.  He’s a rookie, it was his first real game ever.  I recall you having more patience with KCP’s early games.  From Keith Langlois write up:  “Cheeks also gave Siva high marks for his defense, and the rookies were part of a much better collective team defensive effort.”

  • Nov 20, 201311:30 am
    by Derek AKA Redeemed

    Reply

    Gotta give the man his due.  Stuckey has been  wearing his big boy pants this year.  Excellent showing from his last night against an elite defender in Iman Shumpert.  He was poised aggressive.  I hope we continue to get that sort of end-of-the-season-when-the-games-don’t-matter-production out of him.
    KCP does not lack confidence, dude pulled up from the hashmark and still almost hit the shot.  And he put some lock down defense on JR, after watching Singler get abused.
    Seven assists, one turnover with a stomach ailment.  Not bad Mr. Jennings, get well soon.
    Moose, needs to be more decisive when closing out on his man.  Running wildly out to cover your guy on the perimeter will get you son’d everytime.
    Josh Smith, great D.  I’m loving the stat sheet stuffing.
    Drummond cut down on the silly fouls.  Keeping banging it every chance you get.
    Great win.  Let’s keep it going.

    • Nov 20, 201312:19 pm
      by jamesjones_det

      Reply

      Man you guys truly are smoking when it comes to KCP, lock down defense?  He let JR shoot 46% (his best percentage this year) and give up 18 points.  How is that lock down defense?
       
      Go ahead a take a look at Smiths #’s from other games http://espn.go.com/nba/player/_/id/2444/j.r.-smith.
       
      KCP is a decent defender but he’s not playing lock down defense.

      • Nov 20, 20135:39 pm
        by Derek AKA Redeemed

        Reply

        Right so it was Singler getting abused off the dribble.  KCP switched to JR and had dude pulling up his dribble.  He contained JR who enjoyed a good bit of scoring while being guarded by Kyle, not KCP.
        In fairness since he has not built his resume, I’ll say KCP is an active defender who gives consistently aggressive effort on D.  My zeal for the team had me label him a lockdown guy.  I think he has lockdown potential.
        Is that better? :)

  • Nov 20, 201311:50 am
    by jamesjones_det

    Reply

    Timeout… You complain about Jennings chucking on a night when he was 1 for 3 and had 7 assists but praise KCP’s attempts when he was 4 for 12 with zero assists?  And a D vs a B because Jennings just didn’t play enough?  Didn’t score enough? (goes back to my previous comment) had the same shooting %.
     
    It’s fine if you don’t like Jennings but at least try to be unbiased with your comments and reporting or even at least try to explain why one got a D an the other a B.

    • Nov 20, 201312:10 pm
      by Tim Thielke

      Reply

      “You complain about Jennings chucking…”

      That’s a bit of a stretch. I only mentioned the tendency in a comment which started “Get better soon Jennings”–as in health-wise not caliber of play.

      “…on a night when he was 1 for 3 and had 7 assists”

      Yeah, ok, now you’re just being ridiculous. I certainly did not criticize anything about his shooting in this game. And if I had, it would have been his lack of assertion.

      “but praise KCP’s attempts”

      Ummm… no. In fact, I criticized the attempts he was taking. I said the actual shooting looked better, though. They didn’t look like ugly bricks coming out of his hands.

      “And a D vs a B because Jennings just didn’t play enough?”

      Rather the opposite. Jennings got a bad grade because he did so little in so many minutes (although, the assist count was very good). If he had put up the same numbers in fewer minutes, he’d have a better grade.

      “at least try to explain why one got a D an the other a B”

      Obviously, the original post wasn’t just about Jennings and Pope and I wasn’t going to do a head-to-head comparison for every pair of Pistons who played (because that would require 36 blurbs about “here is why player X got this grade vs player Y who got that grade”). But since you ask, the rationale is rather simple:
      1) Pope played much, much better D than Jennings
      2) Pope made his presence much more visible than Jennings
      3) I have an easier grading curve for a rookie (even a lottery one) than a 5th year starting PG making $8M annually.

      • Nov 20, 201312:58 pm
        by CityofKlompton

        Reply

        Ah, the difference between analysis and fanalysis. Keep up the good work, Tim!

      • Nov 20, 20135:26 pm
        by jamesjones_det

        Reply

        I’m not so sure I understand the reasoning for 1)  KCP always plays better D than Jennings and will most likely always be the case, that is a given so that should be thrown out except or at least tempered except for the rare occasions when that’s not true or one is awful and the other is exceptional.

        Pope’s presences was mildly more visible but it wasn’t like KCP was so visible he overshadowed others on the floor, I can think of 3 big plays for KCP and 3 big plays for Jennings on both ends.

        Three is best argument and if you say he just didn’t play up to expectations that is fine.  Having watched the game I would say they played about the same with KCP being slightly better.  I’m not a Jennings fan or trying to stick up for him, I was just trying to understand the rationale behind a good grade vs bad grade for two players that didn’t really do that much overall.

        @CityofKlompton
        That’s analysis not “fanalysis”.

        • Nov 20, 20137:02 pm
          by Tim Thielke

          Reply

          If you want to use the argument of Pope having a much higher expected baseline on D, the inverse would be the case on O, but even more so. And the fact that Pope was at least as good offensively as Jennings in this match would merit him a much higher grade.

          That’s not quite how I look at things, but it holds up, even playing by your rules.

          • Nov 20, 20139:50 pm
            by jamesjones_det

            There are no “rules” here.  It’s simply seeing two people play similar games and trying to understand the rational for your grading…

  • Nov 20, 201312:49 pm
    by Otis

    Reply

    I’m going to pick on Monroe for a second. The complaint is that he didn’t demand the ball much, but how often does this guy get the ball in the low post and have it quickly poked away by active hands? Five times last night, apparently. Seems like it happens multiple times every night. He doesn’t get the number of touches he’s used to this season, but he still gets a lot of touches. He’s just ineffective or a liability half the time. When he’s at the elbow, he’s super passive and tends to quickly dump the ball to a guard; when he’s on the block he keeps turning it over with his awkward, sloppy handles. Even when his shots fall, I don’t really like these Monroe isolayshaun possessions.
     
    To his credit or discredit (I can’t decide) he’s constantly surprising me with putting up these sneaky good numbers. He’ll seem like a complete non factor, and what stands out to me are his boneheaded turnovers and embarrassing defense, then I’ll look at the box score and see he put up 16 and 11 on 75% shooting.
     
    It’s frustrating that he and Stuckey have been two of our most consistent players this season, because I think that will just fuel Joe’s tendencies to sit on his hands at the trade deadline. Stuckey might very well be a terrific trade chip in February, and I’d rather take a step back this season by finally cashing in on the guy than lose him for nothing or keep him around. Especially since it’s always fool’s gold with that guy. Particularly his shooting. In some ways it would be nice to have a GM with some job security, so he wasn’t so desperate to look good NOW. That’s been one of the biggest things plaguing the team the last few years, and I don’t see it changing. Gores made a very big mistake by not firing Joe as his first order of business, I think.

    • Nov 20, 20131:05 pm
      by Corey

      Reply

      It’s to your discredit- not his- that he’s constantly surprising you with sneaky good numbers. We all know you want Monroe traded, and that’s fair enough. There are arguments for it. But you’ve started to see what you want to see. If you’re “constantly surprised” by his good numbers, that means you are expecting him to play much worse than he actually does- and not giving him the credit he’s due, because you’re invested in the idea that he can’t contribute effectively. But 16 and 11 on a good percentage is pretty helpful.

      • Nov 20, 20131:50 pm
        by MIKEYDE248

        Reply

        I agree with you completely Corey, I’m so sick of hearing all the trade Moose comments.  He has been our best player since he signed with the team.  Right now all the talk is about Smith and Drummond, but the future of the team is with Monroe and Drummond.  Smith will probably only be here 4 years, or if he’s here any longer, his skills will be waining.  Other than this one game Monroe has shown that he is trying much harder to play defense.  He is only 23 years old and still has several years of grown ahead of him.
        Smith is several years older and still shows that he can’t destinguish between a good shot and a bad one or to limit his shots when they aren’t dropping.
        Drummond shows that he is still learning the game and still prone to making mistakes.  We are all hoping that he will be one of the top centers in the league, but only time will tell if he is.

        • Nov 20, 20134:42 pm
          by Otis

          Reply

          “Trying harder” on defense. LOL yes. That’s what I want to see. Not results or anything. Dude’s been coasting on D since he got here because all anyone seemed to notice was the fact that he was the only NBA caliber player on the roster for the last three years. But on a team with an acceptable amount of talent, he wouldn’t have stood out quite like he did. He is not a #1 option, not a good defender, and he can’t stretch the floor to save his life.
           
          If you think Moose and Dre are the future of this team, then Joey D made a heinous mistake bringing Smith here. Those three ain’t gonna cut it, and I still don’t understand how anyone expects to build a respectable perimeter with 100% of our resources devoted to them.

      • Nov 20, 20134:36 pm
        by Otis

        Reply

        Corey, there’s no need to be rude. It’s unbecoming.
         
        It’s not to my discredit what I see when I watch these games. Moose took eight shots. If you thought he had a BIG impact on that game (aside from letting Bargnani go off) then I’m not sure what you were looking at. I fast forward through free throws, so that certainly explains why some of his points go under my radar. But hey, It’s not like I’m pretending to be unbiased. I think most of what he contributes we can get from Josh, Dre and whoever we get back in trade. If keeping him on a reasonable contract was an option, I wouldn’t be so eager to trade his slow-but-reliable, only-playing-one-side-of-the-ball ass.

        • Nov 20, 20139:57 pm
          by Corey

          Reply

          I tried to phrase things carefully. I apologize if I came off as rude and over the line. I will say that I tend to argue with your posts more than most, simply because your responses often make me think about the question, even when I disagree. 
          Now let’s go drink a beer and cry about the hawks game. I have no choice but to agree with you that something sure as heck isn’t working.
          My greatest fear about trading Monroe is that it hitches our bandwagon to Josh Smith for four years. Not sure I am comfortable with that.

    • Nov 20, 20134:07 pm
      by Max

      Reply

      You gotta give Otis comedy points for his, “I’m going to pick on Monroe for a second” when he’s been picking on him every time he even says his name.  No20, 2013 • 12:49m

      by Otis
       

  • Nov 20, 20133:24 pm
    by Max

    Reply

    I watched the game last night in NY with my lifelong Knick’s fan dad and we both made of our own teams the entire game and were both convinced, until the Pistons pulled away a bit, that our team would suddenly be down by ten at any moment.   That was a terrible game with both teams playing terrible defense and somebody had to win.
    I was happy the Pistons won and don’t want to get too negative but I really felt like the Pistons pulled away by getting some separation when Carmelo Anthony acted like a total asshole by chewing out the referee for not getting a foul call regarding a play when he was barely touched and didn’t deserve a call at all.  What seemed to follow was a stretch for several minutes of the refs punishing Carmelo and New York which also coincided with Stuckey getting hot.   There was one play where Carmelo clearly should have gotten a continuation and 1 call when Monroe fouled him but the refs made it a side out.   That play by the way was extremely funny because Monroe fouled Carmelo because he was stuck trying to guard him on the outside and nobody helped out.  
    It was almost as funny as when the Knicks did the same thing when Josh Smith crossovered Andrea Bargnani on the same kind of play with no Knick helping out.   All season Smith has just been settling for those threes but he had all the room he wanted to drive on that play and how many times have we seen that this year?—and how many teams have been giving Drummond that many open dunks and oops this year?  It was open season.  
    Towards the end of the 4th quarter, there was a moment when all five Pistons were walking up the offense with a bit of a lead and they were all looking at each other like–”okay, what next?”  What followed was a horrifying sequence of about five possessions in a row when the Pistons didn’t share the ball or run any kind of an offense and kept letting Smith take guarded outside shots.  
    If not for Drummond’s offensive rebounds and putbacks during that point as well as the ref’s stretch following Melo’s technical I don’t think the Pistons would have won last night.    

    • Nov 20, 20133:49 pm
      by Max

      Reply

      Also, no account of the Pistons’ victorious debacle and game for the bloopers would be complete without reference to a few more points.
      1.  Josh Smith’s airballs.   Smith had a few airballs last night but managed to graze the rim ever so slightly–which made JR Smith pick the ball up when he got the rebound, and assuming it was an airball, walk out of bounds to deliver the inbound.   Priceless!
      2. Drummond’s free throws.  Drummond air balled his first free throw and proceeded to miss four more during what was either somehow a single possession or the one right after–I don’t recall.   He missed five in total during the sequence but only got credit for missing four due to a lane violation.   He then made a free throw later in the game which put him at 1-5 for the game even though he unofficially went 1-6.  Still he raised his overall pct for the season with that 1-5.
      3. Soccer or basketball?   Sometime towards the end of the 2nd quarter there was a play when the ball got loose and it seemed to me like player’s on both sides kicked the ball without it getting called and it looked like soccer or pinball out there.   Eventually Stuckey picked the ball up and drove right to the rim where Bargnani fouled him way too late when he’d already gotten the ball up for an end one.  Pure comedy.
      Last night was truly horrifying for those who like a well played game.  

      • Nov 20, 20135:20 pm
        by Tim Thielke

        Reply

        That near airball absolutely deserved mention in the post. My bad.

        • Nov 20, 20137:26 pm
          by Max

          Reply

          We should sent the play over to Shaqtin a fool.

      • Nov 20, 20135:31 pm
        by Toozman

        Reply

        I had a lot of these thoughts watching this game as well.  It looked like a new team trying to figure it out versus a team that’s at the end of the line with their current roster.  If the Knicks had Chandler/Peace/Felton, it’s probably a different result, but they didn’t, so good fortune for us.  It’s going to take some time for the Pistons to see what they have, and what combos will work, and most importantly, what defensive schemes will work, so when we take one from a contender for the final playoff spots, we’ll take it.
        Of course, we’ll probably give it back with a scheduling loss to Atlanta tonight, hopefully we can split with them on Friday………

  • Nov 20, 20133:59 pm
    by Chris

    Reply

    For the Pistons and Mo Cheeks to maximize productivity(wins), Andre Drummond needs to come off the bench. It is better to have Josh Smith starting and playing primarily at power forward. Someone else(Jonas Jerebko) should start at small forward. Drummond being on the bench to start games would improve spacing on offense and allow Greg Monroe to start at center where his foot speed would not be a liability. I would go with Jerebko at the three since he is the Pistons best defender at that position.

    • Nov 20, 20134:02 pm
      by Max

      Reply

      Jerebko fixes the spacing?–and evin if he every so slightly did; don’t you realize the Pistons’ most productive play is missing an outside shot followed by a Drummond putback?

  • Leave a Reply

    Your Ad Here