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Pistons waive Kim English

Vince Ellis of the Detroit Free Press:

Kim English was released by the #Pistons today

You can read my thoughts at ProBasketballTalk. I’m definitely wishing the best for English, but this was easily the correct move for the Pistons.

The contracts page is now updated.

54 Comments

  • Jul 11, 20137:25 pm
    by Swani

    Reply

    Obviously

    • Jul 11, 20139:16 pm
      by schropshire

      Reply

      metta world peace would make us a contender , if  he would accept less for more. (championship drive)

      • Jul 11, 20139:30 pm
        by labatts

        Reply

        You really want him here?

        • Jul 11, 201311:00 pm
          by tarsier

          Reply

          I don’t want him because he’s not very good anymore. But if he signed for the vet’s min, I’d take him.

      • Jul 11, 20139:44 pm
        by Vince

        Reply

        … MWP is never to put on Pistons colors.

  • Jul 11, 20137:27 pm
    by Anthony

    Reply

    Damn. He wasn’t great, but I liked him.  Best if luck to him! I hope he catches on somewhere and succeeds!

  • Jul 11, 20137:27 pm
    by Brian

    Reply

    I really hope that Joe D decides to bring back the other part of the duo in Chauncey Billups and Rip Hamilton since Rip was just let go by the bulls.  It would be great to see them both retire as pistons.  They always played so good together.

    • Jul 11, 20137:29 pm
      by Anthony

      Reply

      Rip was by far my favorite player during that stretch. But bringing him back would be a mistake. Taking minutes away from BK and KCP. Not a good idea. 

    • Jul 11, 20138:35 pm
      by George

      Reply

      I’m not convinced that you’ve seen a game of Pistons basketball since 2004…Rip became a cancer to the team. He and Joe have burnt their bridges. He’s not coming back, nor should we want him back.

    • Jul 12, 20137:41 am
      by Derek AKA Redeemed

      Reply

      @Brian I appreciate what Rip meant to us as a part of the 2004 Championship.  He was certainly a valued teammate and personality during those glory years that followed those Finals appearances.

      HOWEVER…as the team’s success went into a tailspin, Rip was more trouble than he was worth.  His constant feuding with coaches.  His tendancy to give up on the team by frequently tech’ing his way to the locker room was counterproductive.

      Rip on this team would be adding gangrene to an otherwise healthy limb…which is never a good thing.  He wasn’t used on a Chicago Bulls team that desperately needed his skillset in the playoffs.  That appears to me to be a warning sign: Buyer Beware.

      I like Chauncey as a mentor/coach on the floor.

      I like Sheed as a mentor/assistant coach for the bigs.

      I would like Ben Wallace added to strength and conditioning as an assistant to Arnie or a personal trainer for Dre.

  • Jul 11, 20137:35 pm
    by Tony J AD1 for 3!!!

    Reply

    English wrote his own fate today. He was definetly building a mansion with those bricks. Ultimate locker room guy but just doesn’t show the skill to back it up which is a shame because I valued him more than Singler and Middleton when we drafted him… Hope he has the best of luck in the future.

  • Jul 11, 20137:59 pm
    by ffz

    Reply

    this is where you feel bad for people

  • Jul 11, 20138:05 pm
    by Serge

    Reply

    Regardless, Thank you Kim English :(

  • Jul 11, 20138:08 pm
    by ryank

    Reply

     So this leaves 16 including our draft picks.  Siva has been solid…I’m thinking he’s gonna stick.  Two for one with CV and Stuckey?   Our will they buy out Middleton?  Cbill is a one or two year deal, so  Siva would be good to keep around…Cbill might retire mid season with injuries.

    • Jul 11, 20139:34 pm
      by jerrific

      Reply

      Chauncey being signed makes Siva a real longshot. Hard to see the Pistons going into the season with 4 guys they think can play point guard on their roster. 

      • Jul 11, 201310:27 pm
        by Tony J AD1 for 3!!!

        Reply

        I don’t think having 4 PG’s is a problem. Chauncey is at the twilight of his career and might not play due to possible lingering injuries (not official but just my opinion.) Bynum is also getting up in age. Siva can be groomed as a possible 6th man guard under Chauncey… or maybe i’m just imagining too much. haha

        • Jul 11, 201311:15 pm
          by tarsier

          Reply

          It’s a problem because it is wasteful. You don’t want to waste money when you are working with a salary cap. Those 4 PGs come out to an annual total of $16M. If you spend $16M on your PG spot, about 75% of it should go to your starter, with most of the remaining going to a back up and then have an emergency third guy on a min contract.

          I would way rather have a PG worth 8 figures than a hodge podge of assorted basketball fecal matter. 

          • Jul 12, 201312:32 am
            by mike

            Where the heck do you get 16 mil from?

            Knight – 3 mil
            Billups – 2.5
            Bynum – 2.5
            Siva – likely 750k minimum deal

            You’ve somehow doubled the salary of all 4 PGs, as that only adds up to about 8 mil, which might actually be the lowest combined payroll for any team’s PG position. 8 mil for 4 players is nothing.

             

          • Jul 12, 20132:12 am
            by Dan Feldman

            Stuckey

          • Jul 12, 20133:00 am
            by mike

            He was talking 4 PGs being too much if we kept Siva. If you include Stuckey that’s 5 PGs. Stuckey’s not even a PG anyways so no reason to include him. If he’s still even on the team next year, all of his minutes are going to come at SG even without Siva, as Knight/Chauncey/Bynum will take all the PG minutes. So we really only have 3 PGs earning only 8 mil. Carrying another at only 750k shouldn’t be a problem, especially when our frontcourt rotation is likely to only require Drummond/Monroe/Smith. We need guards more than we need bigs. Guys like Jerebko, Slava, and CV can go to make room for Siva. Stuckey could be dealt too.

            I have a feeling Siva stays. They really liked him even before drafting him, and he’s been everything as advertised and more. Add in how they really don’t like Stuckey anymore and I’m pretty sure they’d choose Siva if they had to make a choice. Plus it doesn’t hurt that the Franchise Center really likes him. Smart move by Siva getting in good with Dre lol, but his play also warrants staying too.

          • Jul 12, 20139:33 am
            by tarsier

            I was not counting Siva. I was counting Stuckey.

            And Stuckey is more of a PG than Knight. 

          • Jul 12, 20139:42 am
            by tarsier

            But even if you didn’t count Stuckey, the idea would still hold up. Better to have a starter worth $7M/yr backed up by a guy at $1M/yr and then a third guy who rarely comes off the bench like Siva than to have 4 PGs none of whom are worth over $3M.

          • Jul 12, 201310:01 am
            by RyanK

            I’m shocked you think our PGs are fecal matter.  They’re not allstars, but they are not YMCA over 40 league players either.  

            Billups in particular can shoot the lights out and handle the ball.  He’s never been fast and has never played above the rim…he dunked it a few times and the team went wild because they never see anything athletic from him.  He’s a bully, he’s likely still the strongest point guard in the league and he uses his body well.

             

          • Jul 12, 201311:37 am
            by Tony J AD1 for 3!!!

            Billups won’t last long and Bynum is also on a 2 year contract. Siva also has the “true PG” gene. Everyone complains about a true PG and now that we have a young one that can come off the bench people are worried about too many guards? Stuckey is more than likely gone as well.

          • Jul 12, 201311:52 am
            by Huddy

            How on earth do people keep talking about Siva like he is potentially a 6th man or starting PG.  If the team had space for him and he could wear a suit to games and maybe one day be something fine, but he is not a priority.  Summer league is useless.  Plenty of guys have a great summer league and end up worthless.  The summer league is made up of players pretty much from the last couple drafts, which means there are a handful of top talents like Drummond and a lot of the top picks are injured or don’t participate after their first year.  Guys are playing against a bunch of players who won’t even make NBA teams with a small mixture of real talent.  If summer league is important then based on production KCP would be more like to lose his spot than Siva..but he is not because the initial scouting of these players holds far more weight than summer league (the scouting that let Siva drop all the way to the end of the 2nd round).  How many last 10 picks from the last 5 year’s are even rotation players in the NBA?  You would be lucky to name 5 and if you can find 5 keep in mind that means there are 45 that aren’t. 

          • Jul 12, 20133:56 pm
            by tarsier

            “I’m shocked you think our PGs are fecal matter. ”

            Perhaps I’m overly harsh. But the Pistons have a bunch of PGs and not one of them would I count among the top 25 in the league. That feels wasteful. 

      • Jul 11, 201310:53 pm
        by RyanK

        Reply

        Knight was an off guard last year…Joe refers to him as a combo guard.  Perhaps we’re in a situation where CBill and Bynum are our depth at PG…particularly when you look at Pope and Middleton as our only two guard options if Stuckey is gone.  Throw in the fact it would be an incredible year if CBill is healthy for 82 games and you see we need more in the backcourt.

        Jonas is looking like the odd man out to me…too much depth at PF, not enough at guard.  Maybe they’ll trade the draft rights to Mitchell along with CV and or Stuckey to clear some space.   

        • Jul 12, 201312:08 pm
          by Tony J AD1 for 3!!!

          Reply

          Mitchell has some monster potential. I don’t think they will get rid of him this quickly. Jonas and CV are the likely ones that will be traded.

      • Jul 12, 20131:17 am
        by RalphHau

        Reply

        From what I seen of SIVA, I believe the Pistons will regret it if they don’t sign him.  He is the real floor general.  I like him better than Bynum and even better than BK.  He sees the floor better and he delivers to the bigs.  SIGN SIVA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

      • Jul 12, 20137:45 am
        by Derek AKA Redeemed

        Reply

        Chauncey hasn’t played pg since he left the NY Knicks.  The Clippers had him playing the SG position.  I see Chauncey as another SG on the team, not PG.  He will primarily look for spot up opportunities.  But his time on the floor should resemble what Jason Kidd brought to the Knicks. 

  • Jul 11, 20138:37 pm
    by Kobina

    Reply

    I liked the kid and have a feeling he’ll do just fine.  A little time over seas to season and I would guess he gets another shot.  He seems like a real professional in his demeanor.

    • Jul 11, 20138:42 pm
      by Nick

      Reply

      Agree, always liked him too from day he was drafted.

  • Jul 11, 20138:43 pm
    by David

    Reply

    English showed signs of being good from time to time, just wasn’t consistent , he’ll get another shot with another team

  • Jul 11, 20138:43 pm
    by ffz

    Reply

    so is he finishing summer league with us?

  • Jul 11, 20138:45 pm
    by Nick

    Reply

    Will keep pulling for him.

  • Jul 11, 20138:47 pm
    by Pimp Zombie

    Reply

    Trade Stuckey to OKC for a late 1st round pick

    • Jul 12, 20139:21 am
      by Keith

      Reply

      They couldn’t fit him in their trade exception, and would only give up a first rounder if we would take on Perkins.

  • Jul 11, 20138:48 pm
    by Ryan Kelly

    Reply

    Best of luck to him.   He can still make a good amount of money in Europe and maybe come back to nba one day.   Great kid.  Good first year influence on Andre.  

  • Jul 11, 20139:36 pm
    by jerrific

    Reply

    English always reminded me of a poor man’s Aaron Afflalo. Too bad it didn’t work out, hopefully he sticks with it and gets a chance some where else though!

  • Jul 11, 20139:51 pm
    by Brandon Knight

    Reply

    He was a good guy, we are going to miss him :(

  • Jul 11, 201310:29 pm
    by jamesjones_det

    Reply

    Hate to see him go, but it was an obvious basketball decision.  Best of luck out there!

  • Jul 11, 201311:13 pm
    by PG

    Reply

    Good luck Kimberly. I hope he thrives on his next team.

  • Jul 11, 201311:13 pm
    by Mel

    Reply

    Chauncey will more than likely play some pg and shooting guard like he did with the Clippers. That will allow Knight Bynum and Siva get burn. Then you have CB, KCP, and (Stuckey will be traded). Even though Bynum got signed he still might be used as trade bate, to help get rid of Stuck, jonas, hopefully CV but I doubt that happens

  • Jul 11, 201311:36 pm
    by I HATE FRANK

    Reply

    I really Like Siva, he reminds me of early young tony parker, and he and Drummond have a great connection already

  • Jul 12, 20133:03 am
    by mike

    Reply

    Siva reminds me of Mario Chalmers minus the 3 pt shooting. He’s that championship pedigree PG that may not be super talented but he just knows how to win and is that type of player that helps you win championships.

    • Jul 12, 20139:43 am
      by Keith

      Reply

      Mario Chalmers minus the three point shooting probably wouldn’t be in the league. He’s not an especially strong defender or passer.

      • Jul 12, 201310:18 am
        by I HATE FRANK

        Reply

        Tony Parker came into this league with no real mid-range game, it was all speed and agility…he could get to the basket and make awkward lay-ups…thats what Siva does… Im not saying he is tony Parker or will become tony parker…but his style of play reminds me of a young tony parker

        • Jul 12, 201310:57 am
          by Keith

          Reply

          That could be a fair assessment. Of course, Parker seems a lot more athletic than Siva. Also, while his efficiency numbers were good from the get go, there were some serious grown pains his first three years, to the level that a lot of Spurs fans wanted him traded. Siva, without the elite speed and control of Parker (also without the first round pick status), isn’t going to get the kind of leeway Parker got. PGs who can pass but not score effectively tend not to hold a lot of value long term. Parker was actually a good scorer right away, I’m not sure that we’ve seen that from Siva.

          • Jul 13, 20139:26 am
            by hirobeats

            How do you figure Tony Parker is more athletic than Sive. Siva shocked people with his athletic testing numbers at the combine. kid has a 42 inch vert. 

  • Jul 12, 20136:45 am
    by Jens

    Reply

    It would be fine to find a trade involving Brandon Knight AND Stuckey for a pure PG. It is possible Chauncey starts at the beginning, but this is no Long term Option. And please Forget about those “grooming Knight into an All-Star caliber PG” ideas. This team has to win now. There is no Need to invest another 2 years into an overrated prospect with the Kind of moves Joe has made this summer.  

  • Jul 12, 20139:26 am
    by Moe

    Reply

    Anyone who thinks billups is going to start is on something. 

    • Jul 12, 201311:09 am
      by Lee

      Reply

      My thoughts exactly

    • Jul 12, 201311:15 am
      by Derek AKA Redeemed

      Reply

      @Moe What do you think about the idea of Billups starting at the two like he did with the Clippers and like Jason Kidd did with the Knicks?  He could act as the coach/pressure reliever on the floor and shoot spot up jumpers.

      That approach could help both Brandon and KCP at the beginning of the year.  Brandon learns to read the D better with Chauncey’s presence nearby and KCP gets to see how Chauncey gets open for his shots and draws fouls.

      • Jul 12, 201311:56 am
        by Huddy

        Reply

        Chauncey is too old and beat down to keep up with SGs in starters minutes.  People who talk about him starting forget that he has played about 20 games a season the last 3 seasons.  It would really be asking too much to throw him in the starting line up.

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