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Passing on Trey Burke was the right move … if other moves follow

Dan is in New York and, hopefully, is working on his annual draft post that makes 30 percent of commenters threaten to never read this site again (luckily, that 30 percent is really bad at following through on threats). The epic draft posts are my favorite Feldman posts of the year. I hope everyone is excited as I am.

Anyway, I wasn’t happy Joe Dumars passed on Trey Burke. I think in the longrun, Burke will be a better player than Kentavious Caldwell-Pope. But I still don’t think that Caldwell-Pope was a bad pick, and I loved the Tony Mitchell pick in the second round. Peyton Siva is largely irrelevant to me. Nothing against him, he was a fine college player, but he’s a longshot to make the roster, in my opinion, unless he’s willing to play overseas for a year. So anyway, back to the Burke/Caldwell-Pope debate. In today’s column for the Detroit Free Press, I discussed what will make the pick a success — it starts with bringing back Jose Calderon:

It’s unclear what the Pistons will do in free agency, but if taking Caldwell-Pope over Burke indicates the team will do whatever it can to re-sign Jose Calderon, I’m on board. Calderon will give the Pistons the steady, pass-first, perimeter-shooting point guard they need. The team then can allow Brandon Knight and Rodney Stuckey to battle it out to start at shooting guard until Caldwell-Pope wins that job or, if he’s ready to start from day one, battle for significant backup minutes at both guard spots. Either Knight or Stuckey also could be used as trade bait. But suddenly, the Pistons would have a competent-looking guard rotation with a steady veteran point guard, a young three-and-D shooting guard prospect with good size for the position and one or two versatile combo guards off the bench who can play big minutes depending on situations and matchups.

But what if the plan is not to sign Calderon? What if he was just viewed as an expiring contract to get out of Tayshaun Prince’s contract? What if the plan is to give Knight or, worse, Stuckey, another shot at the starting point guard job? We know how that story ends, right?

The Pistons didn’t do poorly in this draft. Tony Mitchell was a steal in the second round. Caldwell-Pope was a good pick in a vacuum, without thinking about who was on the board when they took him. If Burke hadn’t have been available, most fans would’ve been extremely happy to get a tall, athletic shooting guard who can hit the three. And if the team is able to re-sign Calderon, move either Stuckey or Knight, find a starting-caliber small forward in free agency or via trade and add some frontcourt depth behind Monroe or Drummond, it’s easy to envision them as one of the most improved teams in the Eastern Conference next season.

If the team surrounds Caldwell-Pope with adequate talent and starts winning again, fans will forgive Dumars, even if Burke becomes a star. Unfortunately, though, due to their recent history, the team’s leadership doesn’t get the benefit of the doubt when it comes to their ability to bring in the right mix of talent.

Caldwell-Pope wasn’t necessarily the wrong pick, but his performance alone won’t determine whether he was the right one.

94 Comments

  • Jun 28, 201312:06 pm
    by Faraz1013

    Reply

    Would you want the Pistons to make a move for Rondo? Danny Ainge always puts him on the trading block, and especially now considering the celtics are blowing everything up. 

    • Jun 28, 201312:24 pm
      by Byron

      Reply

      Pistons don’t have the assets to get Rondo unless they were going to move Drummond or Monroe. Was that your plan?

      • Jun 28, 201312:42 pm
        by Phunwin

        Reply

        Not necessarily.  The Celtics are blowing things up, and with Rondo coming off an injury, he could be available for 50 cents on the dollar.  Celtics would surely love to dump the Gerald Wallace contract they had to swallow in the Garnett/Pierce deal; if the Pistons took that on, they could surely craft a deal for Rondo.  Hypothetically, Knight, Singler and a future first (with Villanuenva added for cap ballast) for Rondo and Wallace might work.
        I’m not saying that’s the approach they necessarily should take, but it is possible. 

        • Jun 28, 20131:19 pm
          by tarsier

          Reply

          It makes more sense to trade Stuckey than Villanueva. Villanueva can be amnestied, but only by Detroit. Stuckey is slightly more desirable and can be bought out for half is contract by anyone.

        • Jun 28, 20136:24 pm
          by Byron

          Reply

          I don’t think that’s nearly enough to get Rondo before you even consider that we couldn’t send them a pick until two years after we send Charlotte one, since you can’t trade your first round pick for two years in a row, and we don’t know if Charlotte will get our pick in ’14, ’15, or ’16.

          • Jun 29, 20136:16 pm
            by Ryan

            See other comments from the past few days… If Ainge took back that Nets package so he could tank and get Wiggins, that changes what he wants. Plus, since he was willing to accept picks in 16 and 18 from them, he might from us. So Knight, Stuckey, another player and a pick might get it done. But there’s also the lingering question of what other teams offer – and whether it’s worth it.

      • Jun 28, 20136:15 pm
        by Faraz1013

        Reply

        No, i never suggested monroe or drummond be traded. our biggest asset is our financial situation. We have some expiring contracts (Charlie V, stuckey) and we have the cap space to absorb some ugly contracts. 

        • Jun 28, 20136:18 pm
          by Faraz1013

          Reply

          That was in reference to Byron

  • Jun 28, 201312:09 pm
    by BigMactastic

    Reply

    I don’t mind passing on Burke at all. I love the guy, but he wasn’t a fit. Anyone who watched the team the past few years could see that they were sorely lacking in two areas: scoring and athleticism. I think they addressed those needs this year. But I agree that free agency is key for this team

    • Jun 28, 20131:22 pm
      by tarsier

      Reply

      Burke scored more than Pope, albeit barely, but against much tougher competition and on a team with a lot more mouths to feed. He’s not as athletic, but he’s a better player.

    • Jun 28, 20131:36 pm
      by Max

      Reply

      I see the team as far more sorely lacking in dribbling and passing than athleticism.       

  • Jun 28, 201312:09 pm
    by Tyrell

    Reply

    Well this pretty much sums up how this draft should be viewed. It is a must that the Pistons get a starting SF.

  • Jun 28, 201312:10 pm
    by Crispus

    Reply

    Drafting for need rather than talent shows that Joe is thinking in the near term. I like his draft though and I hope he keeps his wits about him in free agency.

    • Jun 29, 20139:28 am
      by Jens

      Reply

      I agree. At first, I was very disappointed about the KCP pick, but Joe D explained it very well in the presser. he obviously felt that getting that Kind of athletic wing 6ft6 or 6ft7 in FA would be more difficult to do than to get a starting caliber PG.

      I think we can expect some movement on the Pistons rosters until September! 

  • Jun 28, 201312:19 pm
    by Crispus

    Reply

    I wonder if we could somehow spirit Chandler Parsons out of Houston if Hurricane Dwight touches down there. He would be damn near ideal.

    And There are always the awful expiring contracts of Danny Granger and Luol Deng. Both come with serviceable starting SFs (A step up from Corey Spaghetti at least). And in truth, between Middleton, Jerebko, and Singler whoever comes in might just have to keep the spot warm for a year (which is optimistic, I know). 

    And there’s always unproven guys we might be able to get for basement prices and low risk, like PJIII and Royce White.

    • Jun 28, 201312:26 pm
      by Ryan

      Reply

      Parsons or Budinger would be good additions. Management doesn’t get the benefit of the doubt, not even on the fact that they’ll come up with something in the way of player movement, but they have their chances.

    • Jun 28, 20131:23 pm
      by tarsier

      Reply

      I don’t imagine the Rockets are going to be giving up Parsons.

        • Jun 28, 20131:36 pm
          by G

          Reply

          And he gives a lot of production at extremely low cost.

          • Jun 28, 20133:13 pm
            by Ryan

            All of that could change if they lose out on Dwight and Joe offers him a good raise. Most likely a pipe dream though. Scratch another name off the list.

          • Jun 28, 20133:58 pm
            by G

            Parsons has a team option for $900K, which Houston SHOULD pick up unless they want to restructure his contract to give him more money. Basically, there’s no way Detroit gets Parsons. 

        • Jun 28, 20132:11 pm
          by Crispus

          Reply

          Haha I didn’t know about that.

  • Jun 28, 201312:35 pm
    by Otis

    Reply

    This fanbase WILDLY overrates Jose Calderon. It’s insane. I was a big fan of the trade that brought him here (for many reasons), and I was optimistic about having a point guard for once. But I don’t think he ever looked particularly good here, and I think he was a pretty shabby fit. His ratios before the trade were excellent, and it would be an exaggeration to say he’s just a pylon who can pass the ball, but there’s a lot not to like, and I don’t think he qualifies as an above average starting point guard at this point in his career. Maybe he’s the best we can do right now, but that doesn’t inspire hope.
     
    As for passing on Burke, I think it’s a multi-pronged situation, and it mostly has to do with the fact that Joe’s on the hot seat and needs to show major improvement next year (which is a very long shot).
     
    1) In Joe’s make-or-break season, he’s not going to risk his future on a rookie PG. Even if he’s the best player available and it’s better for the team in the long run.
     
    2) Drafting Burke would have left the team with less immediate flexibility. And Joe’s time table for drastically improving the team is “immediate,” again even if it’s not best for the team in the long run. He couldn’t possibly bring back Calderon and have his top three guards be that small, and forget about Bynum. So Joe would head into free agency and trades really just focusing on wings. But what if no starting quality wings ended up being available? He’d have painted himself into a corner.
     
    The right thing to do would be to take the best available player and then adjust. A long-term plan would have involved this approach. Joe’s statement obviously implied that he didn’t think Pope was necessarily the best talent on the board. But from there, you’ve immediately shunted Knight to the bench and/or you’ve pretty desperately got to move him. I totally understand why this happened, because now Joe can trade for or sign at any of the perimeter positions before addressing backup PF and putting the finishing touches on his latest uninspiring lottery-bound roster.
     
    Again, this is all the more reason why Joe should not be allowed to make any decisions with this team anymore. He’s got such a small chance of doing enough this season to save his job. It makes no sense.

    • Jun 28, 20131:25 pm
      by tarsier

      Reply

      I like Calderon, but he’s nothing more than a stop gap. The Pistons need to get a good PG they can roll with for years pronto.

      • Jun 28, 20131:26 pm
        by G

        Reply

        Agree, which is why I like the idea of getting Teague instead.

    • Jun 28, 20131:32 pm
      by Patrick Hayes

      Reply

      I’m not saying Calderon is a long-term solution. I’m saying that he’s light years better than Brandon Knight. So since they drafted Pope over Burke, the other part of that plan better be re-signing Calderon or finding an equal or better replacement, because that player doesn’t exist on the current roster.

      • Jun 29, 20132:31 pm
        by Filo Putz

        Reply

        LIGHT YEARS???? HAHAHAHA.  YOU’RE INSANE!

    • Jun 28, 20131:43 pm
      by cr29

      Reply

      Couldn’t agree more. It’s hard to watch this series of short-term maneuvers geared toward getting into the bottom half of the playoffs.

  • Jun 28, 201312:36 pm
    by MrShourite

    Reply

    Yeah, I like the pick. It came as a little bit of a surprise though with Burke still available. Seems like a fantasy basketball draft when the dude picking in front of you swoops your desire layer because Sacramento scored big time on Ben McClemore and the 36th pick with Ray. I wish the best for Trey but he’s going to the perfect scenario basketball and career wise as to where if he doesn’t become a star then he has no one else to blame. This draft although perceived as being one of the weakest, was one of the most entertaining that I recall in quite some time. But it left you with a couple of questions still….

    Things that made me go hmmm…

    1. With the Piston’s selection of KCP and not taking one of the available PGs with the #8 draft pick; is that an indication of Joe D not wanting to admit that Knight was a failure at PG and the pick was made showing his willingness to give him another shot running the point?

    2. More moves up Joe’s sleeve to upgrade the point guard position? Re-sign Calderon, go after Jeff Teague, target a starting caliber PG via trade perhaps Rondo?

    3. With the 76ers and Pelicans trade (still can’t believe Pelicans) Jrue Holiday going to N.O does this mean that Greivis Vasquez is available? After a breakout season last year, doesn’t seem like you would demote him back to the bench.

    4. How about Boston huh? Danny is not afraid to deal. Does this mean that hes gonna try to move Rondo next? What would it take to get him, young assets, picks, expiring contracts, above average talent?

    5. Free Agency…..? The common theme surrounding the Pistons is that we’ll put our cap to use to get a bigger name via the trade route, but you wonder if we’re gonna wait til after the smoke clears and target 3rd and 4th tier free agents after things settle down.

    6. Keith Langlois mentioned what our summer league squad may look like. He listed our 3 current picks, with Drummond, Singler, English, and Middleton. No Knight or Slava??? (Wish it was still in Vegas sigh)

    7. Sheed a possible assistant coach for us! SHEED. I love what he could potentially bring to the table as our big man coach. Especially on the defensive end. Any other word on Mo Cheeks staff?

  • Jun 28, 201312:37 pm
    by oats

    Reply

    I’d target Teague. Atlanta just drafted Schroeder, and they seem to think they could be in the running for Dwight. Teague seems like he could be had at a somewhat reasonable price, and unlike Calderon he is young enough to be a long term fit. The only other point guard that could conceivably be thought of that way is Jennings, but Teague is a better passer and more efficient scorer, but somehow he has a lower profile and may be cheaper.

    • Jun 28, 201312:58 pm
      by acr

      Reply

      A couple of commenters have mentioned Teague, but I really don’t see how he is that much different than Knight.  Take a look at his first few years in the league, when he didn’t really play much.  It wasn’t till his 3rd and 4th years when he made a jump in terms of PG efficiency, asst/to, etc.  He actually averaged more TO than Knight this year (though with much more assts).  Yes, Teague is a better PG now – but Knight is 21 years old.  Even if Knight turns out to be a better combo guard off the bench as opposed to a PG, his rookie contract with similar production as Teague might be better for us at this moment in time.  

      • Jun 28, 20131:18 pm
        by G

        Reply

        Teague was buried on the bench behind Bibby for his first 2 years. Check his per 36 min numbers. His 3rd year was when he got his first chance to put up numbers, but he showed signs that he was capable the year before.

        I don’t see how Teague gets “similar production” to Knight. Teague scored more, shot the ball better, got nearly twice as many assists with nearly identical turnovers. And he plays better defense at the point.

        • Jun 28, 20131:32 pm
          by tarsier

          Reply

          And even if they were comparable for two seasons and the Teague made a jump, we would know he made that jump. With Knight, we can only hope he might do the same. 

        • Jun 28, 20131:39 pm
          by oats

          Reply

           Teague also hit the 2 to 1 assist to turnover ratio every year in the league. That is important because everyone who has become a capable passer hit that basic threshold early in their careers. Most importantly, Teague has shown significant progress every year in the league while Knight basically just repeated his rookie year.

        • Jun 28, 20132:01 pm
          by acr

          Reply

          I agree that Teague is a better PG right now, but is he really that much better to spend money on this summer?  He’s 4 years older than Knight and it took him awhile to get “it” – he was behind Bibby for a reason, right?  I don’t know, I guess I just feel (or hope?) that Knight can make a similar jump in year 3 that Teague did, and that their production won’t be that different ultimately.  Having Horford and Smith can also help the assist totals, and not having to jack up shots all the time as Knight often did last year as the only player on our team with any semblance of an outside shot can help with shooting percentages.  I wouldn’t hate it if we got Teague, I’m just saying that Knight could very well turn into Teague over the next few years at a much cheaper price.  If we’re going to use cap space for a PG, might as well go for Rondo over Teague.

          • Jun 28, 20132:35 pm
            by G

            Nothing indicates Knight will ever “get it”, at least not as a PG. Like I said before, check Teague’s per 36 min numbers. Every year is better than Knight’s. He’s only 25, which is pretty much entering his prime. Teague is Teague, so there’s no gamble there. Assuming Knight will become Teague is a pretty big gamble, especially since Knight has shown no signs of being competent at the position.

            There are several reasons why I prefer Teague to Rondo at this point.
            - Rondo is 2 years older & is nearing the end of his prime
            - He has a long history of injury problems
            - Rondo can’t shoot, Teague can
            - Rondo isn’t a free agent & must be acquired via trade

          • Jun 28, 20132:43 pm
            by oats

            To answer the first question, yes he is. He put up 14.6 points, 7.2 assists, and 2.9 turnovers at the age of 24. He’s also improved every year. That is exactly the kind of guy that smart GMs spend money on.
             
            For the second question, the reason is that he was a rookie and Bibby was a vet. It’s not exactly a secret that Mike Woodson likes his veteran guys. The second year was Larry Drew’s first season as a coach, and rookie coaches don’t often gamble on young guys. That’s a really big gamble when dealing with a team that won 53 games the year before. It’s hardly a surprise that those guys were hesitant to turn over the team to the 19th pick in the draft. But more than that is tarsier’s point. Even if Teague did make a huge jump, and I still think it was a more gradual improvement than that, that kind of jump is rare enough that it is foolish to bank on someone else making it. If the only way keeping Knight at the point makes sense is if he makes that kind of jump, and it definitely is the only way, then that isn’t a strong enough probability to be worth passing on someone who is already competent for.
             
            By the way, Rondo isn’t just going to cost cap space. Rondo will also cost assets. I honestly don’t know if Detriot has what it takes to get him. Plus, Rondo can’t shoot and Teague can. Teague won’t be as good of a player, but his superior shooting could definitely help close that gap some.

        • Jun 28, 20132:31 pm
          by tarsier

          Reply

          I guess it would depend how much Teague costs and who else you think that money can be spent on.

          Even if Knight does make a leap and he and Teague become redundant, as long as Teague isn’t overpaid, he should be easy to get rid of if that seems the best course of action.

          Right now, though, he seems to be the best FA for fit and likelihood to be signed at a bargain. 

        • Jun 28, 20137:24 pm
          by Filo Putz

          Reply

          What indication have you gotten that Atlanta wouldn’t match whatever is offered. You’ve got a much better shot at Devin Harris.

          • Jun 29, 20134:42 pm
            by frankie d

            teague would be a great pick up.
            he is one of the few guys i’d support spending FA money on.
            the key to forcing atlanta into passing on matching is how you structure the deal.  
            for instance, utah hates portland now because they tried to steal 2 restricted FA’s from utah – matthews and millsap – and each time came up with front loaded contracts that were extemely tough for utah to swallow.  the bit the bullet with millsap, matched it and kept him, though it really messed with their salary cap numbers.  they decided to pass on matthews and he walked to portland.
            (houston got very creative also when they signed jeremy lin away from ny, though they backloaded his contract.)
            if atlanta is presented with that kind of scenario, and have to make a choice between swallowing a contract that is going to wreck havoc on their cap numbers, or going with what they already have – the rookie scroeder and harris -they may decide to go ahead and let teague walk.
            now the bad aspect of this entire scenario…dumars has shown no inclination or ability to think in those kind of creative and aggressive ways in signing guys.  
            maybe he has new guys around him who are better at it than he’s ever been, but his history has been totally deficient in that department. 

      • Jun 28, 20131:37 pm
        by tarsier

        Reply

        It’s also important to note that Teague is a FA. Getting him does not mean losing Knight.

        A starting backcourt of Teague and Pope with Knight backing up both would be solid. And right now, I feel like that’s the best we can hope for. 

        • Jun 28, 20131:42 pm
          by oats

          Reply

          Agreed. I don’t like Knight the starting point guard, but I’m pretty happy with Knight the 6th man.

        • Jun 28, 20132:10 pm
          by acr

          Reply

          Agreed that Knight is at least a good 6th man, and that a solid rotation is probably the best we can hope for.  I guess what I was trying to say is why not shoot high first with our cap space at the 1, 2, or 3 – as opposed to targeting Teague at the 1?    

          • Jun 28, 20132:24 pm
            by tarsier

            Oh definitely. Dumars should be doing all he can to convince CP3 to come to Detroit. I just don’t expect him to succeed. So he may as well then move on to Teague.

            Besides Paul and Iggy, what better FAs at 1, 2, or 3 are there then Teague? I’d take him over Mayo, Jennings, or Ellis. And I don’t see who else is particularly close. 

          • Jun 28, 20132:47 pm
            by oats

            Iggy’s shooting scares me. Andre is clearly the better player, but I would rather Detroit add Teague than add Iguodala. At least that’s how I feel about them when factoring in their relative costs. Teague should be had in $7-10 million range while I’m betting Iggy is in the $12-15 million range.

          • Jun 28, 20132:55 pm
            by acr

            Definitely agreed that apart from Paul and Iggy, there are no other FA really worth the money. Teague is restricted though, isn’t he?  If so, we would likely have to overpay him too so ATL wouldn’t match.  I guess I’m hoping more for trades than FA – Wilson Chandler (who could be available if Denver keeps Iggy, which they have said they want to do), Luol Deng, Eric Bledsoe, Rondo.  I think that all of those players could be available for different reasons (cap space primarily) and they would be great additions.

          • Jun 28, 20133:06 pm
            by G

            Detroit is going to have to overpay almost anyone to get them to come here, why should Teague be any different?

          • Jun 28, 20133:14 pm
            by acr

            true

          • Jun 28, 20133:14 pm
            by oats

            Atlanta drafted Schroeder and sees themselves in the Dwight Howard sweepstakes. If Detroit makes a strong offer then they might just back down.
             
            As for the trades, those guys should be available even if Detroit adds Teague. Detroit can always amnesty CV and have about 30 million available, and there is a decent chance that Stuckey’s expiring would be part of any trade. It’s not a one or the other situation, there is room to do both.
             
            I also don’t get the Eric Bledsoe thing. He is Brandon Knight offensively, but older. Why should Detroit give up any assets to get that guy? Bledsoe is a talented defensive player, but he really doesn’t address Detroit’s glaring need for a distributor. I’d rather keep trying to turn Knight into a point guard, but as I’ve already expressed I’d greatly prefer the team address the position by going after Teague. The going rate on Bledsoe seems to be too high for Detroit to realistically match anyways.

          • Jun 28, 20133:15 pm
            by acr

            allright, you guys convinced me.  go get teague!

          • Jun 28, 20133:20 pm
            by tarsier

            oats,
            I agree that at those prices, Teague would be the much better get

            g and acr,
            Yes, Teague is restricted. So it really depends on how highly Atlanta sees him. The week when GMs can talk to player but not yet sign them is more than enough time to determine if there is any chance Paul would consider coming to Detroit.

            If he won’t, Dumars should sign Teague immediately. That is key because the Hawks would only have three days to match. Hopefully Howard takes his sweet time about making up his mind. That fact my make Atlanta hesitant to commit much money to Teague since they have bigger plans. if they do match, whatever, Detroit hasn’t lost anything in the process.

          • Jun 28, 20133:22 pm
            by Ryan

            Vince Ellis has been saying that Joe hinted at looking at absorption deals above signing outright. Even then, he’s probably only looking at a handful of possibilities – some of the Rockets’ assets if they sign Dwight, some of the Nets’ or Celtics’ “assets.”
             
            Vasquez now becomes available if Teague doesn’t come over (because he’s an RFA and Danny Ferry can determine his fate), but Demps would probably ask for actual assets, not cap space (or maybe Stuckey’s contract would work).
             
            There are some decent “spread-the-floor” guys who can probably come in on the cheap – Korver and Martell Webster were top 10 in 3PT% last year. Budinger’s another RFA who could escape the logjam in Minnesota (now that they took Shabazz) and possibly contribute in Detroit.
             
            Maybe the one guy I think we might be able to overpay and take – because his team now has 5 promising or solid bigs – is Paul Millsap, but obviously that creates a log jam and would either give us an overpaid bench player or force us into a trade.
             
            It’s admittedly getting to be time to accept the KCP pick – because there’s no going back now – and start looking toward July 10, though.

  • Jun 28, 201312:43 pm
    by DG

    Reply

    My biggest regret of missing out on Burke is that regardless of what you feel about his ability to be effective in this league he is a winner.  The Pistons really needed an injection of that winning attitude.

    Otherwise I pretty much agree with everything you said.  I love the Mitchell pick.  I think it was an absolute steal.  I can see him becoming an above average starter at the SF for years to come. I know he’s listed at PF, but he’s smaller and faster than Bennett and has a 7’3″ wingspan.  WOW.  

    The Pistons defense may have gotten a really good injection with these two.

    • Jun 28, 20131:11 pm
      by G

      Reply

      Mitchell is not smaller & faster than Bennett. He’s an inch or so taller & was one of the slowest guys at the combine.

  • Jun 28, 201312:46 pm
    by MrBlockedShot

    Reply

    I agree with Patrick on the fact that everything is relative depending on what’s next for the Pistons. KCP might be the starting SG from day one, no doubt. We haven’t had such a reliable player in that spot for years he can’t compete with, so I don’t see why can’t he be the man. Anyway I have seroius concerns about Calderon re-signing. Here in Spain he has talked with the media a couple of times about his NBA future and he hasn’t made up his mind yet. He said everything is in the air and he had to wait and see for the proper offer. Well, I think he might be looking for a ring instead of two years with more money than chances to get the ring. Hopefully he’s back, I’d love to see him on the roster again.

  • Jun 28, 201312:52 pm
    by DG

    Reply

    The other thing, too, is that if Mitchell starts at the SF and KCP starts at the SG, this just became one of the best rebounding teams in the league.  Both of these guys rebound well for their positions and then you have Monroe and Drummond.  All of a sudden it’s lob city motor city style.  And Knight could be a much more effective PG on a high pace team.

    Hmmm…maybe Joe D had a plan.  Hope it works.  the Pistons could be fun again. 

    • Jun 28, 20131:41 pm
      by Max

      Reply

      Except that no one on the roster can throw a lob.  

    • Jun 28, 20131:48 pm
      by oats

      Reply

      Mitchell is clearly way to slow to be anything but a PF. Andre Drummond is closer to being able to guard SFs.

    • Jun 28, 20132:19 pm
      by tarsier

      Reply

      I’d rather play Mitchell at C than at SF.

      • Jun 28, 20134:01 pm
        by G

        Reply

        Agree agree agree. Lets nip this “Mitchell can play SF” stuff in the bud, before it gets out of hand. He’s a PF, he has a PF’s body and a PF’s skill set. It’s pretty simple & straightforward. 

  • Jun 28, 201312:55 pm
    by Jon

    Reply

    imo this pick means giving knight a chance with talent around him for the first time. if knight shows he can be a successful pg with this talent around him, the pistons make the playoffs and start adding the final pieces to what they think will eventually be a contender. if knight shows that he can’t run this team with all the talent around him, that probably means the pistons don’t do well this year and end up in the same spot as last year giving them a prime chance to get a good pg in smart or andrew harrison.

    • Jun 28, 20137:33 pm
      by Filo Putz

      Reply

      All of what talent around Knight? Let’s wait to see who they add before talking about talent to help Knight. Pope is unproven although by virtue of being able to get a shot off of pull ups and spot threes’ he should help. But the proof will be on the floor.

  • Jun 28, 201312:55 pm
    by labatts

    Reply

    ” if the team is able to re-sign Calderon, move either Stuckey or Knight, find a starting-caliber small forward in free agency or via trade and add some frontcourt depth behind Monroe or Drummond, it’s easy”
     
    See?  It’s easy.

  • Jun 28, 201312:55 pm
    by MrShourite

    Reply

    With that being said, I just can’t see us starting the season with Knight starting at point and trying to be a playoff team. If that’s the scenario, then we are playing to keep our pick that’s up for grabs to the Bobcats next year. We will see.

  • Jun 28, 20131:00 pm
    by Vic

    Reply

    Spot on.

    They got the horses but still need a jockey. Calderon is very necessary…

    Mitchell is A PF now, won’t be an SF for a few years at least. His game is an athletic beast/stretch 4 type of game. No handle, no decision making.

  • Jun 28, 20131:15 pm
    by Scott

    Reply

    KCP definitely starts right away. I think Brandon Knight could be a great 6th man playing the 1 and 2, as long as he can come off the bench without whining. On another note, I don’t really think Jose Calderon was all that crazy about playing for the Pistons, and I doubt he’ll come back. I think Dumars goes in a different direction at PG, I think he makes a run at Brandon Jennings if he can be had for under $8 million, but a trade would make the most sense (Grevis Vasquez needs a new home after the Jrue Holliday trade). Tyreke Evans can play PG and might be able to get similar $ to Jennings, but I think the Pistons want 3 point range out of their PG. The Pistons need to land an all star or borderline all star SF with their cap this summer, that will be imperitive. All in all the Pistons just got younger and more talented after their first 2 picks yesterday, and that is a start. Good bye Stuckey, and Villanueva, possibly even Jerebko depending on what role Tony Mitchell plays himself into this season. Sorry about the long post, but the wheels are spinning after the draft.

  • Jun 28, 20131:26 pm
    by frankie d

    Reply

    remember how rip hamilton looked after chauncey left?
    remember how lost he looked without a good point guard to deliver the ball in his sweet spots on the floor.
    that is how pope will look if joe’s plan is to put knight back at the PG spot.  
    pope is a guy who will need a very good ballhandler/distributor next to him if he is going to succeed.
    as of this date, that player is not on the roster.
    mitchell would have been a great pick if not for the fact that wolters and muscala were right there.
    there is a reason mitchell lasted till the second round, and while it is certainly true that he is an extremely talented player, he is a dumb player and the pistons have more than their share of dumb players on this roster without adding another one.  if he can basically limit his contributions the way that drummond did last year – to rebounding, defense and dunks off lobs – he will be a great addition.
    from what i’ve seen he has shown no inclination to limit his play in that way, unfortunately.
    wolters would have made passing on burke tolerable.  imho, he’ll be a solid PG in the league for the next 10 years.
    muscala will also fill a nice hole.  he’ll be a good big man rotation player.
    imho, the chances of muscala and wolters flaming out are very low.  on the other hand, the chances of mitchell acheiving his potential are very low, while the chances of him being stuck in the d-league is extremely high.  the d league and europe are full of guys like mitchell who just dont get it.  
    what chad ford and everyone else are saying about mitchell sounds suspiciously like the kudos joe got for drafting terrico white.
    go back and read how great everyone thought white might be, and how getting him was such a coup.
    every once in a while, knuckleheads like mitchell – and white – actually get it.  usually they don’t.  and if he doesn’t it ends up being another wasted pick.

    • Jun 28, 20131:59 pm
      by tarsier

      Reply

      That is exactly what you want out of a second rounder. If they are definitely going to be good, they don’t last that long. So you want someone who has a chance to be and you take the risk that they’ll accomplish nothing.

      I liked Wolters, he looked like a solid backup, but better to take a chance on Mitchell. The Pistons already have Stuckey and Knight who can play backup PG.

      • Jun 28, 20132:51 pm
        by oats

        Reply

        I thought Mitchell had the highest upside at that point. Franklin was a close second and was a safer pick, but after getting KCP I thought Mitchell made more sense. The second round choice I disliked was Siva. I wanted Leslie, but Myck Kabongo and DJ Stephens also seem to have a lot more upside than Siva.

        • Jun 28, 20133:08 pm
          by frankie d

          Reply

          can’t killl dumars for taking mitchell.  
          just thought that both wolters and muscala were more of a sure thing.  their ceiling is no where near what mitchell’s is – if that light bulb turns on and he gets it -but i seriously question whether that light will come on for mitchell.
          and as a result, i’d much rather take a shot at a guy like wolters who i think will be a solid rotation PG off the bench or very possibly a starter on a team that can make the playoffs.  he reminds me of steve blake with a little less athleticism but with a better handle on playing the point.  
          muscala is going to surprise folks, i’d bet, and immediately break into atlanta’s line up as a guy who will stretch the floor for their big guys.
          mitchell definitely has a greater upside.  i thought he had top 5, top tier talent.
          but looking at his game, it is clear that he just doesn’t get it, on the court.
          there is also the history of detroit never really showing much patience for guys like mitchell who obviously need a bit of nurturing and tender loving care.  their approach has been to simply bury those guys.  could easily see that happening to mitchell.
          guys like muscala and wolters, who both have more nba-ready games, will fare much better in detroit’s environment. 
          so while mitchell is definitely a very talented guy worth a gamble, i just don’t see detroit as a good team to make that gamble.
           

    • Jun 28, 20137:42 pm
      by Filo Putz

      Reply

      Where do you get this stuff?? He averaged over 18 a game the next 2 seasons after Billups left and 17 a game their last year playing together. Then his age began to show. Try to keep it real buddy.

      • Jun 29, 20136:11 pm
        by frankie d

        Reply

        hamilton was never the same player after billups left.
        i guess you didn’t watch much pistons’ bb during those years cause he clearly went downhill.
        almost all of his numbers plummetted.
        he may have kept that scoring average up, but he did so by being a much lesser ball player all the way around.  just check out his numbers over at BB reference.  there is a clear line: with chauncey and after chauncey.
        the only fans who don’t acknowledge that he was a lesser player are those who don’t want to see it. 

        • Jul 1, 201312:43 am
          by Filo Putz

          Reply

          ok YOU WIN. hAMILTON WOULD HAVE BEEN CRAP IN HIS PRIME IF HE DIDN’T HAVE THE LUCK TO PLAY NEXT TO BILLUPS…. THIS IS JUST SAD HOWWRITERS LIKE YOU LIKE TO POST BUT DON’T ADD RATIONAL DISCOURSE!

    • Jun 29, 201312:01 pm
      by Bill Adams

      Reply

      It wasnt forseen that White was going to have and injury the kid never got a chance. Joe Dumars and the entire front office have been on vacation on until the new owner bought the team two years ago we got rid of the our last coach they wasnt respected by players. Terrico White never got a fair chance. The new owner came in and cut players and salaries during the short season. now Billups and other PG or SG we had in chance should what they had to offer White second yr with the pistons he got shipped out like all the other players bc of the new owner another example is Rudy Gay he got shipped out bc of new owner. So in fairness White never got a chance to show us. The kid received several honors in Europe last year and Dallas Mavs got him for Summer League and i have several agents talking about this guy Terrico White  would be a still bc he has experience now and he did great in Europe. Our problem at the pistons is that we recently got a new owner he is trying to fell out staff members and before that our organization was up in the air. The Moose cant carry us alone. But there is buzz for Terrico White and i hate we let him go. 

  • Jun 28, 20131:44 pm
    by Max

    Reply

    Maybe Moose can play point guard…..

  • Jun 28, 20132:16 pm
    by Ryan Kelly

    Reply

    Knight is not a sg.   And right now at least isn’t very good at all as a starting pg.   he is an ideal 6th man.   Team needs a starting pg until knight develops or full time one if he doesn’t.   Stuckey is the guy that needs to get kicked outta here on his arse. 

  • Jun 28, 20132:56 pm
    by brgulker

    Reply

    I think a lot of people are underestimating Caldwell-Pope (and for the record, this is coming from a guy who loves, loves, loves Trey Burke and has been very vocal about Dumars’ shortcomings). 

    If you look at just about any analytical draft board, KCP was anywhere from a top 3-7 prospect. Somehow, he managed to fly under the radar, in spite of putting up really, really good number as only a sophomore in college.

    Yes, Burke also put up really good number, and in a better conference. I get that. But KCP could be the real deal, and frankly, he might adjust to the NBA quicker than the smaller, slower, weaker Burke.  

  • Jun 28, 20134:30 pm
    by Ron

    Reply

    KCP can  create for himself offf the dribble guys. Don’t overestimate the need for a pg in terms of his ability to score. He can get his on his own just fine.
     In regards to Mitchell I remember reading that the Pistons were his hardedt pre-draft interview and that they really grilled him for his lack of production. The Pistons are well aware of his flaws and I don’t think Joe would have picked him if he didn’t plan on developing his talent to the fullest extent.

    • Jun 28, 20137:58 pm
      by Filo Putz

      Reply

      Thanks Ron for the little bit of sanity. I can’t honestly say I’ve watched Pope, during the season. But on tape he appears to play at a fast pace, can shoot the three and is very quick at getting it off on a pullup off the dribble. What I didn’t see alot of is him taking it all the way to hole and finishing over the trees. Would have prefered Mclemore or Oladipo but what can you do when they’re gone and you pick 8th in a weak draft .

  • [...] the Caldwell-Pope pick––God help the kid if he isn’t Rookie of the Year––but did take a passing shot at Siva: Peyton Siva is largely irrelevant to me. Nothing against him, he was a fine college [...]

  • Jun 28, 201310:47 pm
    by AYC

    Reply

    Burke, Calderon, Vasquez.  Boy, people do love matador defenders at the point.

  • Jun 28, 201311:32 pm
    by Moonchild

    Reply

    I gotta admit i stopped reading this as soon as i saw bring back Calderon.  He can barely make it through an NBA season with his health and is one of the worse defensive guards in the league

  • Jun 29, 20133:37 am
    by Grizz

    Reply

    Really well stated Otis

  • Jun 29, 20134:27 pm
    by ToneTouch804

    Reply

    I still have faith in Knight at PG people fail to realize we have had crowded backcourts both his rookie and sophomore year I like Bynum and Stuckey but both hurt Knight’s development and Gordon did too also glad we didn’t get Burke cuz the reason we got Cheeks as our coach was to help Knight develop at PG Pistons follow me on Twitter and I tweeted them to draft KCP 2 nights before the draft I did the same with Drummond last year

  • Jun 29, 20134:34 pm
    by ToneTouch804

    Reply

    Only players I wanted over KCP are Oladipo, McLemore or Porter and people are panicking I say we save our money and pursue Paul George next year in free agency between Monroe and George Knight wouldn’t have to have high assists numbers

    • Jun 29, 20136:20 pm
      by Ryan

      Reply

      Sounds realistic………………………………

  • Jun 29, 20135:17 pm
    by Shoe

    Reply

    Get Jarrett Jack to run the point… He was great with Golden State this year!

  • Jun 29, 20135:44 pm
    by Trevor

    Reply

    The Calderone love is so short-sighted. I know we haven’t had great PG play, but Calderone undermines the defensive culture of team, and quite frankly dominates the ball (i.e., over dribbles). It’s a lot easier to rack up assists when you insist on holding the ball for half of every shot clock, which in most instances dictates that you will assist on the scoring play. Lebron can get away with that because he’s the best player of his generation. Why the hell do you think Calderone was a backup for years and years on bad Toronto teams? Please answer that before you insist on the Pistons using precious cap space to sign him and hold back younger players that are still developing.

     

    • Jun 29, 20137:23 pm
      by ToneTouch804

      Reply

      I agree with Trevor I’d wait until next free agency for Paul George

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