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Joe Dumars prefers Nate McMillan or Maurice Cheeks; Phil Jackson prefers Brian Shaw

Chris Broussard on the Pistons’ coaching vacancy:

If Jackson has his way, the prevailing thought around the league is that his protégé Brian Shaw will wind up with the job.

On the other hand, sources say Dumars’ top two choices are Nate McMillan and Maurice Cheeks. Dumars also was hoping to make his hire before last week’s NBA draft combine in Chicago, the sources indicated.

Considering the Pistons have yet to interview Shaw and are done interviewing new candidates, it seems unlikely Phil Jackson gets his way.

Will Joe Dumars get his? He preferred Mike Woodson last time, and Tom Gores overruled him to hire Lawrence Frank.

Gores’ late-season statements coupled with his hiring of Jackson has opened plenty of question about Dumars’ status. The coaching hire should tell us plenty about how much power Dumars still holds. 

43 Comments

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    May 23, 20137:34 pm
    by 2013 Pistons Offseason - Page 8

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    [...] [...]

  • May 23, 20137:43 pm
    by CityofKlompton

    Reply

    Oh snap!

  • May 23, 20138:12 pm
    by Reaction

    Reply

    So Budenholzer isn’t a top choice.. In this situation I hope Jackson gets his way. Nate McMillan screams mediocrity and Cheeks really? Just because he has done well with a team full of superstars doesn’t mean he is a good assistant coach. I know the same can be said about Shaw but even with the Pacers he is doing an amazing job and is loved. Hibbert thinks he is ready to coach big time too

    • May 23, 20139:05 pm
      by gmehl

      Reply

      I am all for Shaw to be our next head coach but who was the brainiac that didn’t have Hibbert in on that last play that LeBron blew to the hoop?? I seriously hope Shaw isn’t in charge of defensive sets.

      • May 23, 201310:25 pm
        by mike

        Reply

        I’m pretty sure Vogel took responsiblity for that, but who knows what discussion went on among the coaching staff, including Shaw

      • May 24, 20132:09 am
        by Jon

        Reply

        read the grantland piece on that play. it actually makes sense that most likely there would not be a shot at the rim to need a rim protector for so playing the percentages it was the right move. i don’t know about the other play where hibbert was out but the last play of the game made sense from a coaching standpoint.

    • May 23, 20139:09 pm
      by gmehl

      Reply

      “I know the same can be said about Shaw but even with the Pacers he is doing an amazing job and is loved”
       
      It is worth noting that Frank was loved and well respected as an assistant at NJ. Being loved doesn’t mean shit and we already went down that path with Frank so we have to get it right this time. Don’t get me wrong I am all for Shaw.

  • May 23, 20138:27 pm
    by Chabvis

    Reply

    I don’t understand how McMillan or Cheeks is more appealing to anybody than Shaw really. Not that Shaw is a sure thing, but we have seen what McMillan and Cheeks have done and at no point did people look at them and say “Wow (McMillan or Cheeks) is a great great coach. One of the best in the league.” Isn’t that the point with this signing? Trying to get the best possible coach? I think a coach like McMillan or Cheeks could be the coach of a championship team, but they wouldn’t put on a coaching clinic along the way. I would much prefer taking a chance on someone like Shaw. He could turn out to be a bust and fail of course, but there is at least the possibility that he has greatness in him. McMillan and Cheeks would be much safer candidates, but I really don’t see how you can look at all three of them and say that you really want either McMillan or Cheeks.

    Granted, I am not in on interviews, I am not talking with the candidates, I don’t particularly know what they would be bringing to the table, if players respect them, etc. I am just going on what I am able to see. So if the case is that McMillan and Cheeks look like great candidates in their interviews and are blowing Shaw out of the water (assuming he got an interview to begin with, or will get an interview) than fair enough. I sort of doubt that this is the case though. 

  • May 23, 20138:31 pm
    by Richard

    Reply

    Phil is sitting back and saying go Joe pick one of those guy… As soon Phil is sitting back and saying go Joe pick one of those guy… As soon as the team start losing big time Joe will be let go. The Old buddy help buddy trick huh lol.. Good Luck Joe I like Nate and Shaw myself so I just want the team to start winning again..

  • May 23, 20138:52 pm
    by Travis

    Reply

    Teams can’t interview Shaw, but who is to say Phil Jackson hasn’t reached out to Shaw on behalf of Gores/Dumars? A little loophole in Donnie Wash’s policy.

    • May 23, 20138:55 pm
      by Gary

      Reply

      Have to agree. I mean what is stopping Phil from making the call in Gores or Dumars presence and put Shaw on speaker phone or hand the phone over.

  • May 23, 20138:53 pm
    by Gary

    Reply

    Well, it looks like Jackson will get his way and Dumars job at the end of next season regardless of how the Pistons finish. Not even kidding here because if Shaw is hired it is a sign that Dumars is just around for one more possible great draft choice. Joe D has had a lot of success picking talent lately.

    • May 23, 20139:01 pm
      by Reaction

      Reply

      Joe made the obvious choices. Other teams that let them slide were foolish. Monroe Knight and Drummond all fell to the Pistons. I could have made those picks.. Does that mean I am good at picking talent? No.

      • May 23, 20139:51 pm
        by Pimp Zombie

        Reply

        But he PICKED them…and he didnt let them slide…so you gotta give him his due. Not to mention his less obvious late 1st rd/2nd round picks through the years (Okur, Delfino, Singler, Afflalo)

        • May 23, 201310:10 pm
          by Reaction

          Reply

          Then you should also take into account the fact that he traded Afflalo and missed out on Ty Lawson etc. You can’t just give him a free pass for some of the bad decisions he has made.FYI if he passed on those guys that he drafted (Knight Monroe Drummond), he would have probably been fired by now. 

          • May 25, 20131:42 am
            by Pimp Zombie

            Ummmmm…but he DIDNT.

            My point is, he has shown he is a well enough evaluator of talent. You can punish him for Darko, (dont get me wrong, that was a biggie) but thats about it. 20 plus teams passed on Lawson so you cant harp on Joe for that, just like 30 or so teams passed on Okur (a future allstar) back in the day. You gotta take the good with the bad. Even Donnie Walsh had some stinkers (Jon Bender)

  • May 23, 201310:28 pm
    by mike

    Reply

    I loved the Phil hire, but if Joe is just going to ignore his advice and go with one of his mediocre “buddies” from his playing days, then the Phil thing will have been meaningless.

    I don’t like McMillan or Cheeks at all. Both are decent, but we shouldn’t be striving for decent. I think we can do a lot better. 

  • May 23, 201310:29 pm
    by mike

    Reply

    Dan, 

    Can you somehow post the entire article from Brouusard somewhere?

    I’d love to read more about what’s being said about the Phil/Pistons connection, but don’t have Insider

    • May 24, 20139:52 am
      by G

      Reply

      To summarize, Broussard basically says a lot of eyes are on this coaching hire because it will indicate whether Dumars still has the power in the front office or not. It was full of vague impressions and analysis, nothing definitive or suggesting he had a source close to the situation. You don’t really need to read the whole thing, it doesn’t say anything we don’t already know.

      • May 24, 201311:25 am
        by Huddy

        Reply

        It is all completely useless speculation.  “Thoughts around the league” believe if Shaw is chosen it was Phil and if anyone else is chosen it is Dumars…thanks Columbo (Broussard).  In reality if it is Shaw then Phil influenced it, but he isn’t connected with the organization going forward so he has simply added his two cents and had an effect on the decision, which is what he was brought in to do.  Seems more likely Phil is making up for Gores’ poor HC choosing ability than Dumars’ since the Frank hire is tied more closely to Gores.

  • May 23, 201310:33 pm
    by mike

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    All I know is if we find out later that Joe went against Phil’s advice, and this turns out to be another bad choice by Dumars, not only should he be gone, but I won’t have much faith in Gores anymore either for choosing Joe over Phil.

    I want to know why Gores isn’t offering Phil the same type of package that Hansen offered him for the SEA deal?

    Clearly Gores isn’t 100% sold on Joe. He has an alternative now with Phil. I just don’t know why he would tell Phil to get lost and choose to stay with Joe instead.

     

  • May 23, 201310:33 pm
    by Lake Side Live

    Reply

    I’d take anything Chris Broussard says with a grain of salt, seriously search Chris Broussard on deadspin.com and you’ll see he’s a lazy writer that just retweets stories that are already broken and claims are exclusives from him.

    Plus his article on the whole is some fantasy about Phil using the Pistons job to leverage something with LA or Brooklyn.

         

  • May 23, 201310:36 pm
    by Mrshouriteite

    Reply

    If this latest update has any truth in it then how can you not feel disrespected if you’re Joe Dumars? I think he’s handled this whole “consultant” thing with class so far and Phil Jackson’s presence may or not be what it seems. I think that Jackson and Gores both parlayed this into something for both of them to benefit out of. Phil gets his feet wet in front office management type stuff, while still making numerous headlines on everything under the sun in preparation to take on a more permanent and prominent role with a team’s front office. While Mr. Gores desperately wants to boost ticket sales and make our team relevant again, so having Phil onboard makes us somewhat relevant in the media, and if he could bring some of his winning ways and coaching wisdom our way then its a win-win situation. Don’t let our next coach get us to the playoffs next season, watch Phil get all the credit if that was to happen and Joe D. get painted as the scapegoat if we end up back in the lottery.

    • May 23, 201311:41 pm
      by danny

      Reply

      Very well put and stated.  I agree with what you said about how Joe is handling the current situation.  Just felt like letting you know you shold post here more often. 

  • May 23, 201310:47 pm
    by Edgar

    Reply

    I think it doesn’t matter who the coach is if Dumars keeps telling Gores we can make the playoffs. If Dumars hires McMillan and tells Gores that we can make the playoffs, we’ll just get a repeat of last year. McMillan will feel pressure to make the playoffs given the expectations Dumars and Gores put on him, he’ll play mediocre veterans more than he should, we’ll win 27-30 games and the only thing preventing McMillan from getting fired will be the 5-game win streak we go on at the end of the year against crappy competition that isn’t even trying. Just like the past two seasons with Frank. I can’t wait!

  • May 23, 201311:32 pm
    by kiya

    Reply

    Let Phil Jackson pick the coach because every time joe dumars picks a coach they don’t do a good job 

    • May 24, 20139:29 am
      by MIKEYDE248

      Reply

      You must have been sleeping or in a coma thru the whole middle of the last decade.  His coaches won us a championship and went to eastern conference champions or final for 6 years in a row.

  • May 24, 20131:15 am
    by sam

    Reply

    i wish we get Larry Brown with Monroe and Drummond they would be like Ben Rashed Wallace
    well be like we were in 04  

  • May 24, 20132:07 am
    by joe

    Reply

    I don’t believe this report, the reason why, because this report would go against Gore and the Pistons organization of keeping in house business quiet. I hope Dumars job is more important to him than leaking gossip for reporters, I’m just saying?

  • May 24, 20132:14 am
    by Tom Y.

    Reply

    This is disappointing. I was excited for Budenholzer or Obradovic, was kinda hoping they could maybe get Sloan or SVG on board. Or that maybe even Phil would coach after all. 

    Of these choices, Shaw sounds best. Joe’s choices (if the report is correct) seem to promise yet another boring and mediocre season.

  • May 24, 20134:04 am
    by CityofKlompton

    Reply

    Just a thought, maybe Cheeks and MvMillan are the best candidates that are seriously interested in the job.  Shaw may be Phil’s choice, but how serious is he about being a Pistons head coach right now? We know the Pistons reached out, but not if Shaw interviewed or even has/had interest in doing so.  We interviewed Budenholzer, but maybe he isn’t ready to leave SA and still wants to succeed Pop.  It wouldn’t look good going into free agency with a top choice or two turning down the job after it’s offered.  There is a lot that goes on that we don’t, and probably never will, know about.  Let’s not jump to conclusions.

    These things being said, I’d take Shaw or Budenholzer over either McMilan or Cheeks. 

  • May 24, 20137:14 am
    by Grizz

    Reply

    Shaw or  Budenholzer are more risk, higher reward … Nate isbetter than anyone we have had since Larry Brown …  So .. the bright side is the team is going to get a good head coach .. maybe a great one..  unless Cheeks gets the position … Then I will worry … Joe should never have brought up interviewing Hunter or Walker to Gores .. Let alone actually do it .. Those kind of dumb interview choices just mean Joe is stuck in Buddy Drive … where he just wants an obedient friend to be his coach .. Thus Gores brought in Phil Jackson …. Perhaps Jackson at least stopped any more talk of hiring Hunter or Walker .. I am all in if Gores wants to give Phil Jackson everything he wants .. I am all in if Jackson gets Shaw as the head coach .. but as long as Nate is the final choice .. it still will be an improved situation for the Pistons .. If Joe wouldnt go out and do real dumb stuff .. like giving Charlotte a number 1 draft pick just to take Ben Gordon off our hands … then maybe he would not have Phil Jackson leaning over his shoulder  .. No sympathy since Joe has never had any sympathy about ever using other Bad Boys in the organization ..

    • May 24, 20139:09 am
      by G

      Reply

      I don’t think McMillan is better than Flip.

      • May 24, 20139:36 am
        by MIKEYDE248

        Reply

        Agreed.  I’m not expecting a 60+ win season from McMillan.

        • May 24, 20137:55 pm
          by jay

          Reply

          No one should be expecting 60 wins with this team with any coach… 

  • May 24, 20138:25 am
    by I HATE FRANK

    Reply

    This isnt even a hard choice.

    You have a young team that needs a coach they can relate to and build with.

    Nate McMillian and Cheeks, are old school guys that really havent coached in todays NBA.

    Brian Shaw is a next generation coach cut from the same similar to Nate and Cheeks, when its comes the their experience in the NBA.

    Dumars needs to just fold his hands on this one

  • May 24, 20138:57 am
    by acr

    Reply

    I’ve always liked Cheeks, and wouldn’t mind giving him another shot if he has indeed impressed in interviews.  While he has a mediocre record overall (as does McMillan), he does seem to have a pretty good track record of developing players (Randolph in PORT, Thaddeus Young, Iguodola, and Dalembert in PHIL, and especially has been credited with developing Westbrook and Reggie Jackson in OKC).  Some of his mediocrity as a HC could be explained by losing key players -he had two really strong PORT teams (despite the bafoonery of the “jail blazers”) before Pippen retired and losing Rasheed, and PHIL traded Iverson in his second season there.  He made the playoffs the following year in PHIL with a young team (and even beat us twice in the playoffs).  I think that he could do a good job developing our young players.

    • May 24, 20131:38 pm
      by frankie d

      Reply

      cheeks was directly responsible for a good deal of the “jailblazers” nonsense that went on.
      while he didn’t sign the players, he absolutely failed to exercise due discipline with those players and his failures manifested themselves both on and off the court.
      his players did not respect him, on and off the court, and the resulting problems are part of trailblazer history.
      if cheeks had not done such a shoddy job, mcmillan would not have had such a tough job cleaning up his mess and establishing a new culture where that kind of nonsense did not go on and there was no question about who was in charge.
      anyone who compares mcmillan and cheeks and says they are essentially the same kind of retread obviously doesn’t know what really transpired in portland.
      while mcmillan would not be my ideal choice, he is a solid choice for the pistons and they would benefit greatly from his presence.  he might not be a championship level coach, but he would definitely improve the team and establish a positive culture and identity.
      cheeks would be a disaster.  well, not necessarily a disaster, but someone who would almost guarantee a run of mediocrity or less.  why dumars would even consider such a course is mindboggling.
      let’s hope, as pistons’ fans, that mcmillan accepts his offer if he is indeed one of dumars’ choices.
      shaw?  he’s proven nothing, other than the fact that he’s phil jackson’s boy.
      and excuse me, but i think i’ve forgotten all of the jackson disciples that are having a lot of success in the league as head coaches.  imho, jackson’s success is idiosyncratically his own and the ability of others to duplicate his methods successfully will be very, very limited.
      maybe shaw is the next thibadeau.  i just don’t see it, as i’ve never read anything that suggests that he was responsible for the kind of schemes that guys like that – and dick harter and tex winter, eg – are responsible for.   from what i’ve seen he is just your typical buffer/player friend type of assistant who keeps volatile guys in line and helps prevent some of the crazier ones from choking the head coach.
      kind of what cheeks does now in OKC. 

      • May 24, 20136:33 pm
        by acr

        Reply

        I know that you live (or lived) in the Pacific Northwest, and I don’t claim to know more about Portland basketball than you do, but did you ever consider that it was Cheeks’ first coaching gig and that perhaps he’s learned a thing or two in the last 10 years as a head and assistant coach?  There are few coaches who would have had success if they were put in that position with those personalities on that Portland team. Blaming Cheeks for the downfall of the organization and then arguing that it was then “cleaned up” by McMillan totally omits the role of management in acquiring those players before Cheeks and then getting rid of them as McMillan took over.  I’m not saying that Cheeks is perfect, but your totally dismissing him for something that happened nearly 10 years ago in his first head coaching job.  

        I also didn’t say anything about Shaw in my post, so I guess you were just using the space to vent or something. 

  • May 24, 20139:48 am
    by MIKEYDE248

    Reply

    With out us knowing the whole story on who has been interview or who doesn’t even want to come in for an interview, it’s hard to say Dumars or Phil’s choices are going to be the best for the team.  We may all say that Shaw is the best choice and Dumars isn’t listening to Phil, but for all we know, Shaw doesn’t even want to come in for an interview.  Same with Budenholzer.

    With the list of candidates we have for a coach this year, it’s going to be more either finding a diamond in the rough, like JOE did with Carlisle or picking a re-tread of a former coach that was a mediocre previous coach and just having him click with our team.

  • May 24, 201311:46 am
    by joe

    Reply

    The reason I’m so big on Shaw is, because he already familiar with players like the one’s on the Pistons. If you look at the starters on Indiana and the starters on Detroit their’s a lot of simalarty. The only player that Detroit is really missing is Paul George, but I feel they can compensate for that by drafting Bennet.

  • May 24, 20131:59 pm
    by jay

    Reply

    I’m so disappointed in some of the people on here screaming for Shaw… most of the people who want Shaw only wants him Cuz he s Phil guy… if Shaw is so great n ready to go then how come no other team has hired him for the HC. Don’t get me wrong Shaw could be the next mark Jackson or the next Mike curry.  I just don’t think we are position to take that chance. We need a proven coach like nate who has respect the of today’s player.  Check back to the dream team with nate as assistant for reference …2 of are last 3 coaches were unproven assistants.. one more note chuck Daly had a horrible records with the cavs. Before he took over the pistons 

  • May 28, 201312:58 am
    by jamesjones_det

    Reply

    I don’t like any of the three personally…

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