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Greg Monroe on tough shooting night: “Not converting those shots is unacceptable.”

I threw a bit of a hissyfit in the comments of last night’s game recap when a few readers were suggesting Lawrence Frank should’ve benched Greg Monroe for his struggles offensively.

There are many legitimate criticisms of Frank this season, but this is not one of them. Monroe is not some raw young prospect. He’s in his third season overall and for two of those, he’s undoubtedly been Detroit’s best player (I would also argue he was their best player as a rookie, although his role wasn’t as large as it was last season or this season). Teams simply don’t bench their best player for having a bad game because there’s always a chance your best player will get it together and make plays for you that no one else on your team can make. Exhibit A in this theory was O.J. Mayo last night. Mayo didn’t play well in the first half. But he’s been the Mavericks’ best player this season, Rick Carlisle stuck with him despite his first half struggles and Mayo, with the help of some awful Pistons perimeter defense, got it going in the third quarter and keyed the run that helped the Mavs take control of the game.

Anyway, that didn’t happen for Monroe, and that’s OK. Good players are entitled to occasional off-games. And to Monroe’s credit, he took responsibility after the game. Via Vincent Goodwill of The Detroit News:

“I gotta convert those, there are no excuses,” Monroe said. “My teammates played too hard tonight for me not to convert those. Makeable shots. Not converting those shots is unacceptable.”

Monroe is different than the other young players on Detroit’s roster because he’s already established himself as a very good, consistent, productive NBA player. He deserves the opportunity to play through his struggles that Frank gave him last night. That was the right call be Frank and I honestly don’t understand how anyone can question it.

56 Comments

  • Dec 2, 201210:18 am
    by FREE DRE & BK

    Reply

    I don’t have a problem with Monroe playing, and I don’t suggest he should have been benched.

    • Dec 2, 201210:37 am
      by Patrick Hayes

      Reply

      Other people certainly did.

      • Dec 2, 201211:14 am
        by Georgio

        Reply

        I don’t think he should have been benched, but I thought Monroe was working on his jumper in preparation for the move to PF and last night he said he was not a jump shooter. That was a surprising statement. He is NOT a center, he plays center because at the time that is our best option, but clearly,  after seeing him against Gortat, Gasol and Kaman, he’s not a legit NBA center.  He needs to be able to hit the jump shot to get his defender off balance so he can drive to the hoop, without it they just sit back and wait for him to come to them and with their length or strength they make it difficult for him to finish at the rim. With TWO legit sized centers on our roster, the move to PF for Monroe should be done sooner rather than later. At PF Monroe is actually bigger than most defenders he will see and would be able to use that size advantage in the post. Just think in our division the PFs are Sanders in Mil, Boozer in Chi, West in Ind and Thompson in Clev, all better matchups than the centers on those teams, Dalembert, Noah, Hibbert and Varejeo respectively. Andre and Slava should be our rotation at center and if one is having a really bad game then the other’s minutes go up and maybe at the end of games you slide Monroe in at that spot. But the move should be made NOW and maybe by the break in Feb everyone would be settled in and ready to put together a good second half. 

    • Dec 2, 201210:49 am
      by Patrick Hayes

      Reply

      Also, free BK? Really? A guy who has played 32 minutes a game for his career despite being one of the more turnover prone PGs in the league? The last thing any Knight fan should be complaining about is a lack of minutes.

  • Dec 2, 201211:11 am
    by FREE DRE & BK

    Reply

    Free BK … Means let him play his game from start to finish…

    • Dec 2, 201211:14 am
      by Patrick Hayes

      Reply

      He’s like the third or fourth most efficient offensive player the Pistons have. What if letting him play his game takes away opportunities from more efficient players, Monroe in particular?

      • Dec 2, 201211:42 am
        by FREE DRE & BK

        Reply

        My goodness you just wrote an article saying how he has improved as an offensive player … And No perimeter player on our Roster has Knight Skill set … Stuckey can get to the basket, but doesn’t have the three ball accuracy, Singler has the three ball accuracy but on most night he is not going to take his man one on one ….

        I guess we disagree again…. Nuffin new …

        But Knight was dominating his match up, he had 6-7 ft attempts in the first half … Second half he stopped attacking because the focus was get the ball to monroe who was not winning his match up…

        I’m sure Monroe just had an off game, but that why Knight needs to know he has the Green Light at all times. And its clear that he doesnt

        • Dec 2, 201211:49 am
          by Patrick Hayes

          Reply

          Why do you assume that they just stopped going to Knight? I mean, maybe Knight got tired? Maybe his injury made him less aggressive? It certainly affected his shot — he missed three clean looks really badly in the third.

          Everything is not a coaching decision, no matter how much you want to make it one. Shifting all of the responsibility off of the players and onto the coach does them no good, either. They just flat out played awful in the second half, Knight included, and that’s not on the coach. 

        • Dec 2, 201211:52 am
          by Patrick Hayes

          Reply

          And he has improved as an offensive player for sure. He’s still not efficient though. If you put the ball in his hands a lot, his decision-making is questionable at best. That’s a serious thing that he needs to fix before I consider him a legit primary offensive option on a good team. He’s only one on the Pistons because they’re a bad team. He’s improving, and that’s a good thing, but that doesn’t mean he’s an above average starter at his position yet by any stretch.

          • Dec 2, 20121:29 pm
            by tarsier

            When it comes to Knight, I am starting to realize that this guy just isn’t worth arguing with. he believes Knight is a top 10 PG–right now. He believes that Knight is being short changed on minutes in spite of the fact that not even Stuckey was ever gift wrapped as big a role on this team as Knight. And he believes that Knight should be taking over 15 shots a game in spite of the fact that I have shown him the numbers breakdown and how much Knight’s shooting percentage falls off a cliff when he takes a ton of attempts. I don’t know what more there is to be said to him.

            Former “I HATE FRANK” : Knight :: Jodi Jezz : BG + CV 

          • Dec 2, 20123:27 pm
            by FREE DRE & BK

            your numbers are based on his rookie year, he has improved since then my friend.
             

          • Dec 2, 20124:41 pm
            by tarsier

            Did you not look at the shooting percentages I provided for you from his sophomore year? More importantly, did you provide any evidence at all other than saying that he is now more equipped to jack up a ton of shots than he was a year ago?

            “Using just this season yields a very small sample size so these numbers aren’t as meaningful as the ones I posted earlier. But still this season, with 10 or fewer FGAs, Knight is shooting 34-73 (46.6%). With over 10 FGAs, Knight is shooting 41-104 (39.4%). I’d rather have him shooting 3.8-8.1 (his average <11 FGA game) than 5.1-13.0 (his average >10 FGA game).
            I still don’t see why you think he can shoot at higher volume without sacrificing efficiency. It’s simply a well known fact that just about every player sacrifices accuracy when shooting more. And there is no evidence that Knight is an exception to that rule.” 

          • Dec 3, 201212:53 am
            by Jodi Jezz

            Thanks for the shout out Tarsier…I always had a soft spot for you in my heart, lol…

        • Dec 2, 201210:06 pm
          by gmehl

          Reply

          I guess there is no limit on how many times you can change your username here at pistonpowered :-)

      • Dec 2, 201211:55 am
        by FREE DRE & BK

        Reply

        I guess we disagree again…. Nuffin new …

        And in even in your recent article you speak about his improvements on offense across the board …. And last night he only had one turnover ….until that 20 seconds back n forth of sloppy basketball

        But Knight was dominating his match up, he had 6-7 ft attempts in the first half … Second half he stopped attacking because the focus was get the ball to monroe who was not winning his match up…

        I’m sure Monroe just had an off game, but that why Knight needs to know he has the Green Light at all times. And its clear that he doesnt

        • Dec 2, 201212:08 pm
          by Patrick Hayes

          Reply

          “And last night he only had one turnover ….until that 20 seconds back n forth of sloppy basketball”

          So … he only had one turnover, until he had three turnovers? You have to stop holding the guy’s hand. Over the course of a game, he turned the ball over three times. He doesn’t get points for getting through the first half with only one if he has a really sloppy third quarter. He doesn’t get points for overcoming a bunch of turnovers in a first quarter and making it through the rest of the game without turning it over, as he did in one of the games last week. He has to play a complete game, and it’s totally OK to expect that. You have the bar for his performance insanely low.

          “But Knight was dominating his match up,”

          … until he wasn’t. He was 0-for-6 in the second half. Again, it’s a complete game. You can’t pick and choose aspects of the game where he looked good to do an evaluation of his performance.

          “Second half he stopped attacking because the focus was get the ball to monroe who was not winning his match up”

          First of all, the focus is to always get the ball to Monroe, as it should be, because he’s the team’s best player.

          Secondly, Knight has the ball in his hands more than any player on the team. He shot eight times in the first half, six in the second. He took the second most shots on the team. How, exactly, did he not have ‘the green light’ to shoot?

          Your arguments on this are not based on any kind of reason. 

        • Dec 2, 20122:08 pm
          by tarsier

          Reply

          This back and forth sounds so familiar.

          Knight-man: Knight is a top ten PG this year
          Me: Knight is clearly a below average starting PG this year
          Knight-man: But if you look at just November, he is so much better.
          Me: That takes out one game, which wasn’t even that terrible. So sure, we can just look at November even though that is really arbitrary. And Knight has still been playing poorly.
          Knight-man: But if you ignore turnovers and only look at his best 12 game stretch, he’s been an above average starting PG.
          Me: Sure, but TOs are part of the game and the season is more than those 12 games. So he still hasn’t been great.
          Knight-man: But he had a four game stretch of very good play.
          Me: I’m glad for that. But it’s just four games. Again, you have to look at everything not just some little subsection that supports your stance.
          Knight-man: But he is young, you are expecting too much of him.
          Me: No, I’m pleased with much of his progress. But he is far from a top ten PG. I recognize his youth and the inherent limitations that go with that. Otherwise I would not be pleased with his poor numbers for a starting PG. 

  • Dec 2, 201212:13 pm
    by Domnick

    Reply

    This kind of thing happens when you dont a better lowpost game.. He really cant beat stronger guys without that skill.. It will affect his play.. He needs to have that skill soon… 

  • Dec 2, 201212:20 pm
    by Raphael

    Reply

    Patrick, do you think as Lawrence Frank handle the third quarter well?  I didn’t. I think he should have made an adjustment while the game was still close. He had plenty of opportunity in the third to give Dallas a different look before the blow out began. He seems to stay with whatever rotation he decided before the game begins and rarely deviates from that.  How long do you have to look at one thing that isn’t working before you try something else?

    • Dec 2, 201212:23 pm
      by Patrick Hayes

      Reply

      I personally think his worst decisions were before the third quarter. All of his starters played huge minutes in a tough game vs. Memphis the night before. I think he should’ve got his bench big minutes in the first half and saved his starters some to finish the game. By the third quarter, his starters were gassed and it was too late even if he did go to the bench.

      • Dec 2, 201212:42 pm
        by Chris H

        Reply

        Why do you think Frank had a reluctance to go with his bench?  It’s not like they are all rookies.  I know CV had a bad game, but it’s not like there weren’t other players to go to in this situation.  I mean Prince and Max played 36 min, that’s a lot for vets coming off of a hard game, esp Prince from all of those deep playoff runs in his prime… I mean it’s not like we don’t have any other SFs…

        • Dec 2, 201212:46 pm
          by Patrick Hayes

          Reply

          I honestly have no idea. It was a question I really wish someone would’ve asked him after the game, but based on everything I watched in the postgame coverage and read this morning, no one asked it.

          Like I said, watching last night, I thought that was what cost them the game. He didn’t necessarily have to go deep into his bench, he just should’ve played the four main bench guys he’s using right now more. But apparently no one who covered the game had that same thought, or if the question got asked, I haven’t seen the response yet.

  • Dec 2, 201212:26 pm
    by Ryan Kelly

    Reply

    Knight and Monroe might be good when this teams gets a bonafide stud on the team.  As the number one and two options they just are out of their league.  Ive never seen two guys on the same team be so turnover prone and careless with ball.   Thing is they shouldn’t be in this position.   They are secondary players not stars.  Until they can protect the ball like professionals they won’t be more than that. 

  • Dec 2, 201212:27 pm
    by Kamal

    Reply

    Man, Monroe is the weakest 255 lb dude in the league. If he’s going to continue to play the five, then he needs to at least 265 next season. And Dumars should force Arnie to work on strengthening his legs so he gets more explosion on lay-ups to avoid all of the blocks. Kaman was barely getting off the ground and still able to block Monroe because he plays so far below the rim. Even 6’8 Brand got a piece of Monroe’s shot. 

    I shudder to think what Varejao is going to do to him Monday. 

  • Dec 2, 201212:37 pm
    by Raphael

    Reply

    Good point Patrick. I can agree with that but that also coincides with my point.  The starters were spent and it was obvious.  Lawrence Frank continued to play them without making an adjustment in the third.  He didnt useit he bench totheir benefit at all and be think the only players with a positive efficiency rating was from the bench.  

    How bad does the record have to get before Lawrence gets fired?  I need something to hope for.  

    • Dec 2, 201212:44 pm
      by Patrick Hayes

      Reply

      He’s not going to get fired during the season, and I’d be shocked if he didn’t at least start next season as coach. Dumars made a huge deal about needing to find a long-term coach and how turning over coaches every two years was not a good thing, so he has to let this play out. So unless the players start publicly rebelling and pulling the the embarrassing things that happened under Kuester, I’d say there’s very little chance he’d get fired.

      You have to look at Frank’s perspective in this, too. He’s trying to establish a consistent rotation. Under Curry and Kuester, the Pistons had absolutely no stability or predictability in their rotation. A guy would have a bad game and all of a sudden be yanked from the rotation. Frank has been trying to build trust among the players that they won’t get that kind of quick hook. Sometimes, I think, he’s gone way overboard and stuck with players too long. But I do understand why he’s doing it, considering the mistrust players had with the previous coaches.

  • Dec 2, 20121:07 pm
    by frankie d

    Reply

    one of the disturbing things about frank’s coaching is the way games get out of hand so quickly.
    often, it appears that the opposing coach will make an adjustment that changes the way the game is being played.  and instead of frank making a counter-move that addresses that adjustment, he simply continues on with his game plan – and his same rotation and line-up – and what had been a close game often ends up being a double digit detroit loss.
    (i’d like to see a comparison of the point differential in detroit’s losses, relative to other nba teams.  my guess would be that during frank’s tenure, the pistons have been one of the worst teams as far as loss margin is concerned.)
    the first orlando game was a perfect example. the pistons were rolling, orlando was having a tough shooting game. then it looked like orlando simply changed the way they had reddick and the other shooters, work their screens, come off them in order to spot up for shots.  all of a sudden, orlando players started getting more room on their shots, and what had been a comfortable detroit lead withered away.
    i’m not sure exactly what orlando did, but the impact was obvious.
    last night’s pivot point happened late in the second quarter.  detroit appeared to be in control of the game and in the last 5 minutes or so, dallas changed something and from that point forward, dallas seemed to get into a comfort zone and they pulled away, slowly but surely.
    yea, the 3rd quarter was bad, but it just seemed like a continuation of what had been happening from  late second quarter forward.
    last night was another one of those perfect games when a combo of monroe and drummond would have been a nice move.  it would have put enormous pressure on dallas, which had gone small.  jae crowder, who i love and wish detroit had drafted, is a 6-5 guy who played 30 minutes on the front line with marion and brand and kamen and another nice rookie, bernard james.  james is a very nice defensive player, as is brand, but i’d at least like to have seen what drummond and monroe could have done together against that dallas front line.
    pairing drummond with monroe would have allowed one of those guys to have had an extremely beneficial matchup. 

  • Dec 2, 20122:37 pm
    by frankie d

    Reply

    frank does the same thing that flip saunders used to do.
    in crunch time, he reflexively puts in the starters and absent something extraordinary, he sticks with them.
    that pattern has held pretty much all the way through the year.  
    when flip did it, at least it made a little bit of sense, considering the all-star starting five.
    considering the pistons’ current starters, the same logic does not hold.
    he should be mixing and matching, depending on matchups and how players are playing. 

  • Dec 2, 20122:59 pm
    by FREE DRE & BK

    Reply

    I said in November for a 12 Game Stretch …he was playing like a TOP PG … I also back that with numbers … (Not going to retract my statement) BECAUSE I BACK IT WITH NUMBERS …. I also said he must improve in other areas … I also said I don’t expect him to play last that 4 game stretch all year….

    I Hate when people flip what you say, to make their argument seem stronger… Almost like a person hates when other people are condescending towards them

    • Dec 2, 20123:26 pm
      by tarsier

      Reply

      You said in November, he was a top 10 PG. Not for the 12 game stretch. And even for that 12 game stretch, it requires ignoring his TO issues to put him in the arguably top 10 over that period category.

      • Dec 2, 20123:34 pm
        by FREE DRE & BK

        Reply

        my friend, please go back and review for yourself, because maybe your memory might be a little flawed.

        Originally, i said the 12 games

        you said you cant throw out 25% of the games where he played poor

        So to appease you, i included all of his number Novembers …

        But originally I said during that 12 game stretch, my friend

        please during your free time go back and review for yourself thanks 

        • Dec 2, 20124:25 pm
          by tarsier

          Reply

          Fine, I dredged back through our old conversation to find it. So the first time the term “top ten PG” came up was in

          http://www.pistonpowered.com/2012/11/pistons/#comments

          Nov 29, 2012 • 7:47 am


          “@HiroBeat
          I agree, Last year people were down on Knight, and earlier this year people were down on Knight…In the Month of November , he has been a Top 10 PG/Combo guard …. when you look at Numbers and performace ”

          I see no mention of 12 games, but rather of the month of November. Granted, you weren’t talking to me at the time. But this was the comment that started our exchange. 

          • Dec 3, 201212:39 pm
            by I HATE FRANK

            i hate to play on words… but it WAS IN THE MONTH OF NOVEMBER … However,  ”immediately” made the focus on the 12 game stretch….

            Put I know sometimes communication is an issue….

            and I did not ignore the turnovers, because like i said other players have flaws …

            But we are going to talk in circles.

            so i will let it go 

    • Dec 2, 20123:28 pm
      by tarsier

      Reply

      I’m not trying to put words in anyone’s mouth. But your claims of Knight’s excellence always require disclaimers of essentially “except for when he played terribly”.

      • Dec 2, 20123:44 pm
        by FREE DRE & BK

        Reply

        “How is a guy averaging 13, 3, and 6 with 3 TOs and just half a steal on 43% from the field and 75% from the line a top 10 PG?”
        1. 13ppg 44% from the field 47% for 3?s 6ast , 3 to’s ….. 3.5 rebs ….(i always round up, or I round down) Now list the other 10 pg’s playing better…. in November? and he only has been averaging 31minutes per game, and only averaging 10-11 shots per -game… which makes him efficient…  “Why would there be a mea culpa? I would probably qualify as one of Knight’s detractors (not that I think he won’t amount to much, but I think it is far from a given that he will). I did not expect huge things from Knight. but I expected more than he’s shown. His numbers for the season are, quite frankly, substandard.”
        2. last 12 games…. out of the 16 games played… he scoring 15ppg shooting 47% from the field , and 48-49% for 3?s … if that substandard? name the other players currently doing that?“Limiting our view to the month of November doesn’t change much either. That only removes one game in which he put up number pretty close to his averages for the season (better points, rebounds, steals, TOs and worse assists, percentages).”
        3. it makes no sense to ignore his play for the bulk of the season…If i was just looking at the last 4 games alone, then yes, but he has been building up to those games.
        I love when people argue against numbers, its the same mindset, that would say Maxiell over Drummond… 

  • Dec 2, 20123:46 pm
    by FREE DRE & BK

    Reply

    his is going to be fun…
    “What do you even mean by this? I round to the nearest. On some counts, that improves his stats, on some it worsens them, but it evens out pretty well.”
    This is about the only thing we will agree, on we just used different terms
    31.1 mpg puts him 74th in the league. So just a hair above average for starters. In other words, his minutes are not worth mentioning to point out that he log a ton or relatively few. “Only” is not a fitting term. I wouldn’t have brought this up but you did first.”
    For STARTING PG… Knight is 23rd in the league… example: Kemba Walker (3rd) gets 37mins per-game, and Damian Lilliard (2nd) gets 37 minutes per-game..Knight “ONLY” plays 31 minutes…6 more minutes a game thats half of a NBA quater, it create more opportunities scoring,ast,rebs ect….
    “13 points on 10.5 shots is not highly efficient. It’s not highly inefficient either, I’ll grant you, until you throw in the 1.75:1 AST:TO ratio. But that is there. So yeah, it is inefficient.”
    Knight in November, and YES! im talking NOVEMBER… Knight is 27th in the league for shot attempts…, shooting 43.8% (round to the nearest 44%) he is ranked 10th-11th among starting PG…. for 3 point shooting 46.7 (round to the nearest 47%) among starting NBA PG he is ranked 1st! … That not highly efficient? because their are players you’ve listed better than him NOT in top 20 for either category… and I agree he needs to be better with the ball, but he is doing soo many other things well…His TS% among starting PG..Knight is in the top 5! …. “Umm, okay, off the top of my head: Chris Paul, Rajon Rondo, Mike Conley, Jrue Holiday, Tony Parker, Deron Williams, Goran Dragic, Russel Westbrook, Greivis Vasquez, Jose Calderon, Raymond Felton, Jeff Teague, Brandon Jennings. That’s gotta be at least 10. And Steph Curry, Jeremy Lin, Ty Lawson, Darren Collison, Kemba Walker, Damian Lillard, Luke Ridnour, and Ramon Sessions are all at least arguably outperforming him… in November (which, again, is basically the same as saying this season to date). “
    Show me the stats…Because the numbers dont back half the people on your list…unless you are basing it ALL on “the 1.75:1 AST:TO ratio” …  Example: Kemba Walker does get steals, but does NOTHING ELSE BETTER THAN KNIGHT! other than score more but he takes 7 more shot attempts, and shots under 39% and 25% for 3?s…Jermey Lin? really 10.3ppg 6.5ast 3.0 tos …4.5 rebs 37% from the Field and 24% for 3?s … and he’s playing better than Knight?… I could easily pick apart your list…“Yeah, everyone looks good if you throw out the worst 25% of their games. And I agree that there are only a handful of players matching all of those statistical threshholds. However, at least half of the list I made above before the “arguable” section is putting up better numbers by significantly outperforming those levels in some areas while falling a little short in others.”I agree. But I’m not sure what the point you are trying to make is. I don’t see any reason to look at November numbers instead of season long numbers. But whatever, look at either one, they are nearly identical.”
    The 12 game stretch marks a turn around in his game, that the point I was making. Where he has been scoring and shooting better, making better decision. At the end of the day he has played GOOD Basketball in November, the only thing he can do better trying to eliminate turnovers,and would I like his steals to go up? YES, but Stls DOES NOT mean you are playing solid or good defense, just like blks dont make you a post defender.“First, please don’t be condescending. You can call me an idiot or whatever. But condescension really, really annoys me. Second, what numbers am I arguing against? I was providing numbers. The numbers Knight has been producing. Yes, over the last 4 games, Knight has been fantastic. So I guess I argued against using just a small subset of his games at such an early point in the season, but I am including those fantastic games. They are worth just as much as the poor ones preceding them. You are the one oddly trying to argue against his numbers from the first one to four games of the season.”
    I love a healthy debate, and would never call any one an idiot, but I am sarcastic by nature. Listen, I know he is not going to be 20ppg 50% FG and 60% for 3?s all year, and i’ve always said he needs to be a legit scoring threat to be effective, I could careless about him being a masterful PG averaging 8-10ast pg… Knight is showing us his potential, in another system with a different coach Knight Numbers would be better across the board. All im saying he give him praise, FOR RIGHT NOW…

  • Dec 2, 20123:49 pm
    by FREE DRE & BK

    Reply

    smh… We often ignore facts, to justify our foolishness…then you went on to agree with me about how he has improved offensively, and about his limited minutes, and I agree with you about him needing to take care of the ball better…
     

    • Dec 2, 20124:32 pm
      by tarsier

      Reply

      I did agree that he has improved as I referenced in my summary (for which, I’ll admit, I may have taken too much license in putting into my own words) of our back-and-forth:

      “Knight-man: But he is young, you are expecting too much of him.
      Me: No, I’m pleased with much of his progress. But he is far from a top ten PG. I recognize his youth and the inherent limitations that go with that. Otherwise I would not be pleased with his poor numbers for a starting PG. “ 

      I also agreed that you were right about him getting fewer minutes than the average starting PG, but about average for a starter from any position. I did not agree that he deserves more minutes as the average starting PG has outperformed him.

      So when did I depart from or contradict any of that? 

  • Dec 2, 20123:51 pm
    by FREE DRE & BK

    Reply

    How about we both wait and see what kind of player Knight will be by time the half way mark of the season…

  • Dec 2, 20125:16 pm
    by Mark

    Reply

    I get the theory of staying with your best offensive players, like DAL did with Mayo, but you also have to take into account the particular player in question. When has Monroe ever suddenly taken over a game offensively, esp late in a game? He’s not a SG who suddenly gets hot and takes over. Thats not his game. His game is slow and steady, and he’s always been more effective early than late. So by midway through the 3rd if he;s still not getting it done, its hard to imagine him suddenly going off for a huge finish to the game. Considering its really never happened before and he’s not that type of player.

    Thats when you have to know your personnel and know that even if he does start making some shots, its probably not going to be a huge impact on the game, to where its worth the risk of keeping him in. 

    If it were Knight we’re talking about, who had been playing great lately offensively, and HAS shown the ability to take over games late offensively, then I would agree with letting him keep shooting. Monroe is not that kind of scorer. If I were Frank, seeing that Knight did have it going pretty good last night, and Monroe is still an excellent passer even if his shot isn’t going, I would’ve been designing plays for Monroe to pass out of the post to Knight for 3′s and take me chances with Knight shooting. 

  • Dec 2, 20128:35 pm
    by hirobeats

    Reply

    lets be clear, I know I just got all emo yesterday about how I’m I Knight fan, and I do believe that he is better when he plays aggressive… BUT I can’t act like he isn’t a work in progress… in other words, please don’t put in the “knight-man” category…

    • Dec 2, 201210:17 pm
      by Patrick Hayes

      Reply

      Haha, I totally understand your position and I’m in the same boat. I like Knight a lot, work ethic-wise, he’s exactly the type of young player I’d want on my team. I just have to try to not let that admiration for his work ethic and maturity cloud my evaluation of some of the real deficiencies in his game right now. I think he has what it takes to work past those things for sure though.

      • Dec 3, 20128:38 am
        by I HATE FRANK

        Reply

        lets be clear, I DO NOT BELIEVE overall Knight is a top 10 PG…. but for almost a full month Knight shooting the ball GREAT, he was rebounding, defending, even his assist were around 6 ast….. YES! TO’s are a issue, i never denied that… but other player might have fewer TO’s but they are struggling in other areas where Knight did excel at the PG position.

        Example: Kemba Walker 2.4 to’s 6 ast (solid ratio) … but he shooting under 40% from the field … he is 26% 3′s attempting 3 shots from behind the arc per-game, but making 0.8 attempts .

         i guess its all about what you value…. 

    • Dec 2, 201211:50 pm
      by tarsier

      Reply

      When i said Knight-man, I wasn’t referring to you. I was referring to the former “I HATE FRANK” and present “FREE DRE & BK”. The only reason for the term is that I didn’t know what to call him because his name keeps changing.

      • Dec 3, 20127:44 am
        by I HATE FRANK

        Reply

        you can call me Ray

         

  • Dec 2, 20128:48 pm
    by DasMark

    Reply

    Nice blurb, Greg. Now stop missing! 

    There are so many limited offensive players that have a great jump shot, Monroe has no excuse. Verajao, Ibaka, Big Baby, Joakim Noah and more would be considered limited offensively, but they all have a mid-range jumper in their arsenal. 

  • Dec 2, 20129:14 pm
    by Delray313

    Reply

    our defense is why we loss period, Oj Mayo took singler to school and stuckey too. i think prince should have been on him it might have made a slight difference. I think drummond has to play more because he needs a lot of work but his upside is great on both ends. I rather see daye or jj instead of maggette i think he is ok but he wont be here long anyway. We need a veteran center to help dre and help monroe out on some nights so he can go to Pf. and these turnovers are getting a little out of hand as a collective unit they gave away a lot of points.

    • Dec 2, 201210:54 pm
      by Patrick Hayes

      Reply

      I agree with you on the defense being the reason the team lost. But Prince wasn’t better than the guys you mentioned defensively, either — he kept giving Vince Carter open looks that Vince was knocking down.

  • Dec 2, 20129:34 pm
    by domnick

    Reply

    he had no midrange j’s but he needs to be a back-to-the basket player first.. before doing some jumpshots

    his game is mostly off-the ball movement… or driving to the hoop using his quick feet.. too predictable… he needs to bang his way towards the basket to make his prescence felt and at the same time…

  • Dec 2, 201210:40 pm
    by Visions

    Reply

    If a player is performing poorly he should be pulled from the game, sit on the bench and get his thinking in order. Frank is a very limited coach in seeing the whole picture. He is rigid, closed minded, inflexible and set in a pattern, even when losing there is no awakening. He can’t see the long range potential of this team. He refuses to or is unware of empowering his player. How can a young team grow if they don’t play…Why not empower and play other players… If they are losing why not play other players….His comments about inserting players don’t make sense to me…The Pistons will continue to regress unless Frank’s change his limited rigid mind set. He’s not open for development.

    • Dec 2, 201210:53 pm
      by Patrick Hayes

      Reply

      “If a player is performing poorly he should be pulled from the game, sit on the bench and get his thinking in order.”

      So the Lakers should bench Kobe Bryant if he’s shooting poorly? 

  • Dec 3, 20122:22 am
    by DG

    Reply

    Good players find other ways to contribute even when their shots are off.  Monroe did have 15 rebounds.  So he did at least help out in another way.

  • Dec 3, 20122:44 am
    by gmehl

    Reply

    Looks like Dion Waiters will be out for tomorrow nights game with an ankle sprain. If we can’t beat the Cavs without Irving and Waiters i will literately cry. Game plan should be to limit Varejao.

  • Dec 3, 20127:16 am
    by @GPMasters

    Reply

    Regarding Maxiell’s performance vs the Mavs, does anyone else think he would just LOVE to play for them next season? Home town and all. Sorry for the cynicism.

    • Dec 3, 201211:53 am
      by revken

      Reply

      I think a good argument could be made that Maxiell is having his best seaon ever for us.  That’s not to say he’s a top-10 PF, or to discount the possibility that he’s playing with his next contract in mind.  But I think he’s earning his minutes and playing pretty close to his ceiling.  He certainly defended well enough against Zach Randolph in Memphis.  He could be a valuable player coming off the bench for lots of teams.  I hope that will be his role for the Pistons by season’s end.

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