Comments on: Ben Wallace, Hall of Famer? http://www.pistonpowered.com/2012/02/ben-wallace-hall-of-famer/ Your Go-To Source For Pistons Coverage Thu, 23 May 2013 09:56:01 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.4.1 By: Jamie http://www.pistonpowered.com/2012/02/ben-wallace-hall-of-famer/comment-page-1/#comment-55055 Jamie Fri, 02 Mar 2012 01:41:35 +0000 http://www.pistonpowered.com/2012/02/ben-wallace-hall-of-famer/#comment-55055 I really feel like ben wallace deserves to be in the hall of fame. He was a 4 or a 5 time all star, 2004 champion, a bunch of all nba defensive teams, nba leader in blocks a bunch of times, league leader in rebounds a few seasons, some DPOY awards and not to mention this guy was undrafted out of virginia union. That looks like a pretty solid career to me. He is one of the best players the pistons have had and one of the best defensive players the nba has had. Yea people are going to criticize his offense but he averaged like 3 or 4 offensive rebounds a game and thats helps out your team a lot the last time i checked. So i really cant see how he wouldnt make the hall of fame even though he didnt do much on offense but then you think of dennis rodman. The worm didnt do much on offense either but crash the glass and the thing is he never averaged no where near the blocks ben did. The only differance i see is that dennis played more than ben did throughout his carrer. Could you imagine how much better bens carrer would have been if he played more. Regardless I still feel like big ben is deserving of a trip to springfield to be inducted into the hall of fame. I really feel like ben wallace deserves to be in the hall of fame. He was a 4 or a 5 time all star, 2004 champion, a bunch of all nba defensive teams, nba leader in blocks a bunch of times, league leader in rebounds a few seasons, some DPOY awards and not to mention this guy was undrafted out of virginia union. That looks like a pretty solid career to me. He is one of the best players the pistons have had and one of the best defensive players the nba has had. Yea people are going to criticize his offense but he averaged like 3 or 4 offensive rebounds a game and thats helps out your team a lot the last time i checked. So i really cant see how he wouldnt make the hall of fame even though he didnt do much on offense but then you think of dennis rodman. The worm didnt do much on offense either but crash the glass and the thing is he never averaged no where near the blocks ben did. The only differance i see is that dennis played more than ben did throughout his carrer. Could you imagine how much better bens carrer would have been if he played more. Regardless I still feel like big ben is deserving of a trip to springfield to be inducted into the hall of fame.

]]> By: frankie d http://www.pistonpowered.com/2012/02/ben-wallace-hall-of-famer/comment-page-1/#comment-51519 frankie d Fri, 17 Feb 2012 16:51:10 +0000 http://www.pistonpowered.com/2012/02/ben-wallace-hall-of-famer/#comment-51519 @tarsier, first, i dont accept your premise. where does that criteria come from? did you pull it out of...thin air. this is what someone who knows about HOF criteria says: "<strong>There are no black and white criteria</strong>," says John Doleva, president of the Naismith Memorial Basketball Hall of Fame. "Decisions are <strong>based as much on quality as on quantity</strong>. <strong>Players aren't voted in because they played for this many NCAA champions or participated in two NBA Finals or any set criteria</strong>." <a href="http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/columns/story?id=2394981" rel="nofollow">http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/columns/story?id=2394981</a> quality as much as quantity.  enough said. the idea that someone must have more than 6 or 7 great seasons to qualify has no credence.  it is based on nothing but your opinion.  you're welcome to that but it has no bearing as to whether a guy like ben is HOF material. additionally, a precedent is established when there is one example that fits. 10? no.  one example, one case establishes a precedent. if i argue a case before a court, i dont need 10 or 5 or3 cases in order to establish a basis for my argument.  all i need is one case.  and there are plenty of examples.   there are probably 10, but i dont feel like researching it.   i a post above i mentioned 3 or 4 names. however, one doesn't need to look too far to find a very similar case: joe dumars.   i love dumars, but his numbers are marginal.  there is also adrian dantley, artis gilmore, james worthy, bob macadoo, kevin mchale, alex english, calvin murphy, dave cowens, earl monroe... the list of guys who don't fit your arbitrary, criteria is long and illustrious. fortunately, your criteria has been specifcally rejected by the people who count, the guys who run the HOF, as they've opted for a much more flexible set of criteria. @tarsier,
first, i dont accept your premise.
where does that criteria come from?
did you pull it out of…thin air.
this is what someone who knows about HOF criteria says:
“There are no black and white criteria,” says John Doleva, president of the Naismith Memorial Basketball Hall of Fame. “Decisions are based as much on quality as on quantity. Players aren’t voted in because they played for this many NCAA champions or participated in two NBA Finals or any set criteria.”
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/columns/story?id=2394981
quality as much as quantity.  enough said.
the idea that someone must have more than 6 or 7 great seasons to qualify has no credence.  it is based on nothing but your opinion.  you’re welcome to that but it has no bearing as to whether a guy like ben is HOF material.
additionally, a precedent is established when there is one example that fits.
10?
no.  one example, one case establishes a precedent. if i argue a case before a court, i dont need 10 or 5 or3 cases in order to establish a basis for my argument.  all i need is one case.  and there are plenty of examples.  
there are probably 10, but i dont feel like researching it.  
i a post above i mentioned 3 or 4 names.
however, one doesn’t need to look too far to find a very similar case: joe dumars.   i love dumars, but his numbers are marginal.  there is also adrian dantley, artis gilmore, james worthy, bob macadoo, kevin mchale, alex english, calvin murphy, dave cowens, earl monroe…
the list of guys who don’t fit your arbitrary, criteria is long and illustrious.
fortunately, your criteria has been specifcally rejected by the people who count, the guys who run the HOF, as they’ve opted for a much more flexible set of criteria.

]]> By: frankie d http://www.pistonpowered.com/2012/02/ben-wallace-hall-of-famer/comment-page-1/#comment-51392 frankie d Fri, 17 Feb 2012 01:17:13 +0000 http://www.pistonpowered.com/2012/02/ben-wallace-hall-of-famer/#comment-51392 weird, my post got deleted.  except for the symbol. i simply posted taht i was in favor of more players not fewer being admitted.  and players like artis gilmore, robert parrish, james worthy, gus johnson, dennis johnson and others could not stand up to the strict scrutiny you want to apply to ben. the more the merrier, as far as i'm concerned. weird, my post got deleted.  except for the symbol.
i simply posted taht i was in favor of more players not fewer being admitted.  and players like artis gilmore, robert parrish, james worthy, gus johnson, dennis johnson and others could not stand up to the strict scrutiny you want to apply to ben.
the more the merrier, as far as i’m concerned.

]]> By: frankie d http://www.pistonpowered.com/2012/02/ben-wallace-hall-of-famer/comment-page-1/#comment-51389 frankie d Fri, 17 Feb 2012 01:14:55 +0000 http://www.pistonpowered.com/2012/02/ben-wallace-hall-of-famer/#comment-51389 @ @

]]> By: Coach_Ackley http://www.pistonpowered.com/2012/02/ben-wallace-hall-of-famer/comment-page-1/#comment-51384 Coach_Ackley Fri, 17 Feb 2012 00:41:37 +0000 http://www.pistonpowered.com/2012/02/ben-wallace-hall-of-famer/#comment-51384 <strong>@tarsier. Look at what Patrick just posted about Mullin nuff said... I think scoring is overrated in the NBA cuz that's all players nowadays wanna do is score and not play D but if you look at Big Bens defensive stats yeah he should get in.. Name one person who has played D better than Big Ben since he became a Piston let alone who could guard Shaq 1 on 1 like big ben did when he was a defensive PIMP...........</strong>   @tarsier. Look at what Patrick just posted about Mullin nuff said… I think scoring is overrated in the NBA cuz that’s all players nowadays wanna do is score and not play D but if you look at Big Bens defensive stats yeah he should get in.. Name one person who has played D better than Big Ben since he became a Piston let alone who could guard Shaq 1 on 1 like big ben did when he was a defensive PIMP………..
 

]]> By: tarsier http://www.pistonpowered.com/2012/02/ben-wallace-hall-of-famer/comment-page-1/#comment-51359 tarsier Thu, 16 Feb 2012 21:59:04 +0000 http://www.pistonpowered.com/2012/02/ben-wallace-hall-of-famer/#comment-51359 And 7 is generous. Ben's first year on the Bulls really wasn't an elite year. He was still good, but his impact was significantly diminished from the past 6 years. And 7 is generous. Ben’s first year on the Bulls really wasn’t an elite year. He was still good, but his impact was significantly diminished from the past 6 years.

]]> By: tarsier http://www.pistonpowered.com/2012/02/ben-wallace-hall-of-famer/comment-page-1/#comment-51294 tarsier Thu, 16 Feb 2012 18:15:18 +0000 http://www.pistonpowered.com/2012/02/ben-wallace-hall-of-famer/#comment-51294 I could see putting Ben and Chauncey on a higher tier than Rip and Prince. BUt I would have to put Sheed up there with them. He wasn't consistent, but when he brought it, he was certainly the best player on the team. I could see putting Ben and Chauncey on a higher tier than Rip and Prince. BUt I would have to put Sheed up there with them. He wasn’t consistent, but when he brought it, he was certainly the best player on the team.

]]> By: D_S_V http://www.pistonpowered.com/2012/02/ben-wallace-hall-of-famer/comment-page-1/#comment-51270 D_S_V Thu, 16 Feb 2012 16:35:39 +0000 http://www.pistonpowered.com/2012/02/ben-wallace-hall-of-famer/#comment-51270 Just one? How about we start with lack of a post game. tarsier you seem to have the amazing ability to both agree and disagree with every point made on this topic! Haha, I'm playing, mostly. The one thing you said earlier that stuck out was your ranking of the 2004 starting lineup. I'd say Ben and Chauncey were on their own tier, Rip and Sheed a second tier, and Tayshaun would never rank ahead of any of them, IMO. Agreed though, part of the fun about that team was the fact that an argument could even exist over who was the best. I'd be willing to listen to someone vouch for Rip or Sheed as the best, but I don't think I could be convinced that either were more integral than Ben and Chauncey. Just one? How about we start with lack of a post game.

tarsier you seem to have the amazing ability to both agree and disagree with every point made on this topic! Haha, I’m playing, mostly. The one thing you said earlier that stuck out was your ranking of the 2004 starting lineup. I’d say Ben and Chauncey were on their own tier, Rip and Sheed a second tier, and Tayshaun would never rank ahead of any of them, IMO. Agreed though, part of the fun about that team was the fact that an argument could even exist over who was the best. I’d be willing to listen to someone vouch for Rip or Sheed as the best, but I don’t think I could be convinced that either were more integral than Ben and Chauncey.

]]> By: tarsier http://www.pistonpowered.com/2012/02/ben-wallace-hall-of-famer/comment-page-1/#comment-51145 tarsier Thu, 16 Feb 2012 05:45:41 +0000 http://www.pistonpowered.com/2012/02/ben-wallace-hall-of-famer/#comment-51145 Most HOF players' primes last longer than 7 years. And most have less precipitous drops on either side of their primes. I challenged frankie d on this and he has yet to reply. Seriously, find me 10 HOF players with 7 or fewer great seasons. Not ocunting those who are in for their NCAA or international careers or cultural impact like being the first black people in the league. Most HOF players’ primes last longer than 7 years. And most have less precipitous drops on either side of their primes. I challenged frankie d on this and he has yet to reply. Seriously, find me 10 HOF players with 7 or fewer great seasons. Not ocunting those who are in for their NCAA or international careers or cultural impact like being the first black people in the league.

]]> By: tarsier http://www.pistonpowered.com/2012/02/ben-wallace-hall-of-famer/comment-page-1/#comment-51121 tarsier Thu, 16 Feb 2012 04:53:14 +0000 http://www.pistonpowered.com/2012/02/ben-wallace-hall-of-famer/#comment-51121 "he flat out couldn’t do most things well on offense" come on, he couldn't do one thing well on offense, namely shoot the j. tell me one other thing he couldnt do well. also, i find it interesting how you are trying to make a case for wallace by talking about him being offensively incompetent.  wallace was valuable on offense, his offensive rebounding may be the most overlooked part of his game, and that is one of the stronger forgotten points for his HOF candidacy, “he flat out couldn’t do most things well on offense”

come on, he couldn’t do one thing well on offense, namely shoot the j. tell me one other thing he couldnt do well. also, i find it interesting how you are trying to make a case for wallace by talking about him being offensively incompetent.  wallace was valuable on offense, his offensive rebounding may be the most overlooked part of his game, and that is one of the stronger forgotten points for his HOF candidacy,

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