↓ Login/Logout ↓
Schedule/Results
↓ Roster ↓
Salaries
↓ Archives ↓
↓ About ↓

Charlie Villanueva leading amnesty-clause victim for the Detroit Pistons

Chad Ford of ESPN:

Most likely amnesty cut: Charlie Villanueva

How likely to use amnesty this season? Jump ball

Other amnesty candidates: Rip Hamilton, Ben Gordon

Analysis: It’s widely assumed that the Pistons will waive Rip after all of last season’s chaos. He’s scheduled to earn $12.5 million this season and he has a partially guaranteed contract worth $9 million in 2012-13. Throw in the fact that the 33-year-old was seriously unhappy throughout the short-lived John Kuester era, plus Detroit’s longstanding struggles to find a trade taker for him, and amnesty sounds like a natural solution.

Yet sources say the Pistons still believe Hamilton has some trade appeal to contending teams, particularly as he moves closer to the end of his contract. Debatable as rival teams might find that stance, word is Villanueva looms as the more probable amnesty option.

Villanueva has $24 million left on his contract and averaged a mere 3.9 rebounds per game last season while earning $7.5 million. Gordon, meanwhile, is still owed $37 million and coming off a similarly punchless season for a team overflowing with guards. Which one will it be? Someone will go, but cutting ties with either would be an expensive admission for Joe Dumars that the Pistons’ substantial 2009 summer funds were misspent. The latest word is that the Pistons, with new owner Tom Gores still just settling in, have yet to make a firm decision on exactly whom to release.

If the Pistons can wait two years to use the amnesty clause, as ESPN’s Marc Stein reported could be possible, should they do it? Right now, they don’t have a clear target. Richard Hamilton, Ben Gordon and Charlie Villanueva are all capable of playing well. By waiting until next offseason, Detroit could better assess those players – at the risk of paying them another year.

28 Comments

  • Oct 31, 201112:44 pm
    by DVS

    Reply

    i’d be surprised to see CV get cut. Even with his embarrassing lack of production, he’s only a mil or two overpaid and could still be traded far easier than BG. BG should be on maybe $8mil a year, not the $12 or so he’s currently on.
     
     

    • Nov 29, 201112:24 am
      by Stuck

      Reply

      Please get rid of CV.  Extend Jerebko while you can on the cheap. Jerebko is a STUD and CV is just SLOW.

  • Oct 31, 201112:49 pm
    by Jodi Jezz

    Reply

    Dumars isn’t the type of GM to cut ties with his players on bad terms, so I don’t think we’ll use the amnesty clause at all…We can trade any one of those players and bring back value…

    • Oct 31, 20111:03 pm
      by DVS

      Reply

      Dumars will always look after “his guys”, but I think he’d like a do over with both BG and CV. The ’04 guys got looked after because they won a championship for Detroit, BG and CV have given the team nothing.
      And i’m sure Gores won’t be happy with the production of those two either.
       

    • Oct 31, 20111:33 pm
      by tarsier

      Reply

      If indeed, the amnesty can be held onto until the end of the CBA, Detroit may be best served by not using it off the bat. The fact of the matter is that until they are out from under BG and CV, the team doesn’t have much potential to go anywhere. If Dumars manages to trade one of them for a non-bad-contract, it would make sense to amnesty the other. But if not, might as well let them come off the books together and try to make a splash then with the insurance of an unused amnesty still in his back pocket.

  • Oct 31, 20111:35 pm
    by random nba fan

    Reply

    Ben Gordon would be my leading candidate for amnesty clause victim.  There was a reason that Chicago was unwilling to pay him the kind of money he wanted–Gordon is a one dimensional player.  He can score buckets, and he can score them quickly.  This is a very useful skill in the NBA, it just isn’t a skill that is worth the money that he is being paid.

  • Oct 31, 20112:03 pm
    by Will

    Reply

    I wouldnt cut CV, Gordon, or Rip. Rip can be traded for decent value and I’d have CV and Gordon in the rotation for sure. They have gotten a bad rap because they havent been productive but look at how the coaching staff has used them…sporadically. When they have gotten good minutes I’ve been happy with how they’ve played. I’d cut Maxiell. He’s making $5 million and he hasn’t hardly played a lick.

    • Oct 31, 20112:58 pm
      by tarsier

      Reply

      Why does everyone say these players have been used sporadically? They received plenty of minutes. And then, when they didn’t do anything with all that time on the court, they started losing some of it.

      Through the first 65 games of last season, Ben Gordon averaged nearly 30 mpg and was under 20 minutes just 6 times before his lack of accomplishments caught up to the point that Kuester just couldn’t justify giving him such a big role anymore.

      Through the first 33 games of last season, CV averaged over 25 mpg with just 4 games of fewer than 20 minutes. He also produced so little (and Monroe started doing well) that Kuester had to take minutes away.

      But BG and CV didn’t perform poorly because of sporadic minutes. They got their minutes at first. Their court time became sporadic because they played horribly.

    • Oct 31, 20113:03 pm
      by tarsier

      Reply

      Two more things: Rip cannot be traded for decent value. His contract is getting close enough to used up that he can almost be traded for nothing as opposed to having to package assets with him to get rid of the man. But nobody is giving value for him.
      Also, using an amnesty on Maxiell would be a total waste. Yeah, he is definitely overpaid. But getting his contract off the books accomplishes nothing for the Pistons. They still would have no cap space. And they would still have to pay him to not play, just like they currently do. It is only worthwhile if they can use that money as cap space on somebody else.

  • Oct 31, 20114:05 pm
    by Jodi Jezz

    Reply

    @Will, I agree…I don’t think its right for people to throw CV and Gordon under the bus when they were playing under the Kuester staff…Lets give them time under Frank, especially Gordon…I don’t see anything wrong with CV scoring 11pts off the bench and receiving 20mins here and there, that’s fine with me…Gordon can be productive if we play him correctly and Kuester didn’t play him correctly, in addition we had a logjam at the SG position…I also believe we can bring some value back if we trade Rip…
     
    @Tarsier, I understand what your saying about BG, but we didn’t have a PG…Now we have one so lets see how Gordon adjust…Stuckey is a pure combo guard, and I think he is closer to the side of the SG position then the PG position…

    • Oct 31, 20114:47 pm
      by DSV

      Reply

      @ Jodi… I’m just curious, what do you see as the best case scenario for the Pistons moving forward in the next couple years? You have some interesting perspectives on the potential of some of our current players and I was just wondering what your perfect world scenario for the Pistons would be.

      • Oct 31, 20116:07 pm
        by Jodi Jezz

        Reply

        @DVS, I responded below

        • Nov 1, 20113:43 am
          by DVS

          Reply

          that’s DSV not me. ;)
          I already know your crazy ideas about the future of the pistons, jodi. haha jokes

          • Nov 1, 201111:44 pm
            by tarsier

            Are DSV and DVS different people? if so, that’s really weird and slightly confusing. If not, I’m surprised I’ve seen so many posts from both names lately.

    • Nov 1, 20111:13 pm
      by tarsier

      Reply

      You really think it’s any kind of guarantee that Knight is a better PG as a rookie than Stuckey was last year?
      Stuckey is a combo guard through and through. He’s not just a PG but he can play the position very adequately and in any other era would probably be an above average starting PG. I’m not crazy about the guy, but I definitely think there is less than a 50% chance that the very raw Knight will be a better PG his rookie season.

  • Oct 31, 20116:06 pm
    by Jodi Jezz

    Reply

    I believe the best scenario for the Pistons would be to trade for Center and Small Forward..I like A.Daye as much as the next fan but he doesn’t play defense well enough to be a starter…Other teams might beg the differ and I would accept a trade for Beasley or Josh Smith(and play him at the SF position) if offered…At the Center, I honestly think we need a defensive stopper, someone like DeAndre Jordan or Okafor would fit fine…I think Gordon potential is still there and if we had to trade him I believe multiple teams would call for him…But my perfect lineup would look like this if we didn’t use the amnesty clause and traded players,
    (str) Knight, Stuckey, Beasley or Smith, Monroe, Okafor
    (bnh) Stuckey, Gordon, T-Mac, CV, Monroe
    or, if we have to trade Gordon we should target a player with similar value
    (str) Knight, Igoudola, Daye, Monroe, Okafor
    (bnh) Knight, Stuckey, Singlar, CV, Monroe
     
    *Both these scenarios are using the 3-guard rotation that Dumars is trying to accomplish…Dumars is trying to get a team that was similar to his team back in the 80′s…Thomas, Dumars Johnson, into the Knight, Stuckey, Gordon…

    • Oct 31, 201110:32 pm
      by Patrick Hayes

      Reply

      There’s so much to love about this crazy comment. If you called the Hawks and offered Austin Daye for Josh Smith they would think they were getting a prank call from DetroitPCB or something. And you complain about Daye’s defense, but think Beasley’s would be better? I think the Pistons should just trade Jason Maxiell for Dwight Howard. Maybe they could get Orlando to throw in Jameer Nelson too.

      • Nov 1, 20113:49 am
        by DVS

        Reply

        hahahaha Jodi is a good sport, but he’s crazy. I’m not the first and i won’t be the last to say it. :D
        Daye for Smith or magically acquiring okafor without giving up value is absurd.
         

        • Nov 1, 201112:18 pm
          by Jodi Jezz

          Reply

          @DVS, maybe a Daye, Gordon, and future 1st rounder can get us josh smith…Or a Rip, Daye, and future 1st rounder can get us josh smith…We could get Okafor in a three team trade involving S&T Prince, Bynum, and Jerebko…There are possibilities!

          • Nov 1, 20111:23 pm
            by tarsier

            Daye is a marginal prospect. Gordon has negative value (cuz he is paid much more than he is worth). Josh Smith is an all-star caliber player who is young, efficient, strong on defense, and doesn’t need the ball to be effective (if he stopped shooting 3s again, he’d be any contender’s wet dream). That trade is so far from happening. Beasley could happen though. And if you are trading away Daye and Jerekbko, he’d be great to have. Give him a chance to try to grow or at least establish more trade value then he’ll get in the crowded rotation in Minny.

            Prince, Bynum, and Jerebko are definitely enough to fetch Okafor though. I’m not quite sure how you would 3-team it, but it is at least plausible.

          • Nov 1, 20114:33 pm
            by DVS

            @Jodi…
            daye, Gordon and and a future 1st may get us value, but look at that trade from atlantas perspective. BG has a huge contract and plays the same position as Joe Johnson who has an even bigger contract.
            Daye and a future 1st doesn’t give them enough incentive to move a player of josh smiths caliber, especially when you consider his age.
            getting Okafor would be a great addition for us, but what will it cost us. His contract is a big one and giving up a guy like jonas and a future pick is a little too much IMO. Rebuilding teams should really hold onto their 1st rounders.
            Keep in mind jonas won’t get a huge contract, but he’s a young productive starting caliber guy with room to develop. and that’s only in isolation. look at our team as a whole, jonas is one of very few that works his butt off every game at both ends of the court, I’d be very reluctant to trade him away ATM. he’s the type of player we need on this team.
            if we can offer something like Rip, Max and smaller incentive for okafor as a salary dump for them, then yeah that works for me, but putting in a lot of assets into a trade that nets us a guy that gets paid like an all star but doesn’t produce like one doesn’t make sense to me.

      • Nov 1, 201112:13 pm
        by Jodi Jezz

        Reply

        @Pat, thanks…I’m sure a Jerebko and Monroe front court would be perfect scenario for the pistons future! lol…

        • Nov 1, 20111:35 pm
          by tarsier

          Reply

          No the best scenario for the Pistons is to stink it up until they draft a superstar (at any position). In the meantime, their bad contracts can expire so they will have some cap space and they can acquire a few more lesser assets in drafts and whatnot. Then, once they are sure they have an upcoming superstar, they use their cap space to get another very good player (probably not a superstar but someone of Josh Smith caliber). Finally, they trade a few of their good but not great prospects for another very good player. Then they can be serious contenders.

          As things currently stand, they don’t have a great team, but they can’t trade their way there. You pretty much need a superstar. Only one team in history has won a title without one. And those Pistons had two fringe all-stars (I know Ben Wallace was really an all-star but talent-wise, I consider him a fringe all-star. He got in because there were two good centers in the league and they were both in the west) on basically MLEs, another on a rookie-scale contract, still had to pull off the Sheed deal, and were still heavy underdogs.

          • Nov 1, 20111:38 pm
            by tarsier

            Cleveland is rebuilding smarter than any other team in the league right now. Taking on bad contracts that come with nice future assets. Now if they have a lick of sesne, they will trade Varejaoand any other present assets for future assets so that their whole team can come to fruition at once as the bad deals come off the books.

  • Nov 1, 20113:34 am
    by Daniel

    Reply

    I think Pistons should wait with the amnesty…CV or BG are overpaid, well CV not that much but as a BIG he should at least try to play BIG…but still, we have new owner, new coach and hopefully new approach to the game…so I suppose the Pistons should wait to see how coach Frank can use this guys. I believe BG can still be 20+ scorer without using all pistons posessions

  • Nov 1, 20118:14 am
    by detroitpcb

    Reply

    Given that we just drafted Knight and anyone with a lick of sense knows we should resign Stuckey, a guard needs to go. If Rip is untradable (and i don’t believe that), then definitely Ben Gordon should be the amnesty case.

    he has played like shit throughout his entire stint in Detroit.

    and for people like Jodi Jazz who complain about Austin daye’s defense, have you ever watched Ben Gordon’s?

    • Nov 1, 201111:50 pm
      by tarsier

      Reply

      Resigning Stuckey is not necessarily a good idea. It all depends on the price tag. Assuming a lockout shortened free agency to 3 weeks, Dumars should initially wait and see what the market is (a week or so). That should be enough time to get most of the desirable free agents off the market. If Stuckey has an offer by then, it’s simple: decide if he is worth that much and match or decline accordingly. If not, his value will have to have dropped with all the other good free agents getting deals and him not. Then Dumars should give him a low ball offer: maybe 4 yrs/$15M. If after a week, he hasn’t taken it and nobody else has given an offer, he can go up a bit to maybe 5 yrs/$25M. If Stuckey doesn’t want that either and has no other offers, let him take the QO and try to negotiate an extension or trade him before he walks next offseason.

  • Nov 29, 201112:23 am
    by Stuck

    Reply

    Please get rid of CV.  Extend Jerebko while you can on the cheap.
    Jerebko is a STUD and CV is just SLOW.

  • Leave a Reply

    Your Ad Here