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Charlie Villanueva listed at No. 191, Will Bynum at No. 188 in ESPN #NBARank

Arguably the most polarizing Piston, Charlie Villanueva, has now been unveiled in the ESPN NBA Rankings, coming in at No. 191 overall.

I’ll reserve my opinions and allow everyone else what they think in the comments. Is the ranking fair? Too high? Too low? I think Brady Ford on Twitter summed up how many Pistons fans feel about Villanueva:

@NBAonESPN Last season, the 6’9″ Villanueva made $23,796.61 for every rebound he collected. Money well spent Joe D!”

The basic issue for Villanueva is that the Pistons’ greatest need is for a big bodied scorer, rebounder and defender down low. Villanueva has the size at 6-foot-11 and he does have a diverse, if highly streaky, skillset offensively. But his defense and rebounding have fallen way short of expectations in Detroit, even if he is capable of the occasional scoring outburst.

Will Bynum, meanwhile, came in just ahead of Villanueva at No. 188. I’m really happy to see Bynum at that spot. I fully realize he has some flaws in his game as well, but I’ve also appreciated how hard he’s played since arriving in Detroit and I have the utmost respect for the journey he took just to have a NBA career. It’s frankly nice to see him out-ranking one of Detroit’s high priced underachievers.

Other Pistons unveiled in the rankings are: Jonas Jerebko (206), Austin Daye (217), Ben Wallace (227), Jason Maxiell (239), Brandon Knight (267), Chris Wilcox (330), Kyle Singler (446), Terrico White (472) and Vernon Macklin (498).

If you’re on Twitter, feel free to follow along. The @NBAonESPN account is unveiling the names and picking the best comments that use the #NBARank hashtag for retweets and also featuring some on ESPN.com.


  • Sep 15, 20114:46 pm
    by tarsier


    In response to that stat on CV, last season Tim Duncan made $27,581.12 for every rebound he collected. The point being that income per stat is a useless way of analyzing any player. A guy who can give you 12-5-3-1-1 is probably worth the MLE or so. A guy who gives you 24-10-6-2-2 is easily a max contract player.

    • Sep 15, 20115:06 pm
      by Patrick Hayes


      I didn’t quote it because I think it’s a good way to measure anything, just to point out that the major frustration for fans with Villanueva has to do with the chronic lack of rebounding.

      Terry Mills was a terrible defender who was more comfortable on the perimeter than in the post, but I think fans generally put up with those flaws because the dude made some effort on the boards. I think if Villanueva got even 7 boards a game in Detroit, he’d be criticized a lot less.

      • Sep 15, 20115:23 pm
        by tarsier


        I wasn’t faulting you for the stat. Nor do I think there is anything wrong with pointing it out. I was just trying to say that it doesn’t mean much. But yeah, it’s probably safe to say that if CV doubled his rebounding, there’d be fewer complaints about him. Heck, if just his scoring was consistent and efficient, that would make a huge difference.

  • Sep 15, 20115:09 pm
    by Tim


    What pistons fan wouldnt rank JJ over CV every time?  I understand why hes ranked higher here due to JJs limited nba time and injury, but are there seriously pistons fans who are still behind CV?

    • Sep 15, 20115:16 pm
      by Patrick Hayes


      Based on the comments on this site over the last year (not a scientific assessment, I know), not really. I think he’s easily the player who there are the most negative comments about, with Gordon probably second and Hamilton/Stuckey vying for third. But while Hamilton, Gordon and Stuckey have a lot of detractors, all three also have really staunch supporters too. The best support Villanueva gets tends to be of the “well, he’d be fine if they used him as a stretch four/bench scorer” variety. That’s really more an admission that he has major flaws but could still be an effective player in a limited role rather than a defense of him though.

      And yeah, Jerebko is way better but what I’ve noticed in these rankings is that players like Jerebko who happen to play for bad teams aren’t noticed by non-local writers as much as guys like Villanueva who are bad but happen to occasionally put up decent scoring numbers. Amir Johnson is another good example of a guy who should probably be ranked higher and is better than some guys immediately in front of him (Jeff Teague, for example). But hey, that’s the way it has always been. Scoring is the stat that most people assign the most value to.

  • Sep 15, 20115:33 pm
    by Laser


    i’m very happy bynum beat out charlie hustle, not sure how i feel about gordon beating out bynum. he’s a better shooter by any standard, but i know which one i’d rather have on my team at any price. also, as cool as it was for jj to rank around 200, ditto for him over charlie. 100 times out of 100 on both counts.

    • Sep 15, 20118:41 pm
      by Patrick Hayes


      I’ve found that a handful of players are getting by on reputation more than current ability, and Gordon will probably be one of those guys who will be ranked too high. I think some national writers/media folks remember him more from Chicago and haven’t grasped how far his production has fallen the past two seasons.

  • Sep 15, 20116:33 pm
    by Jodi Jezz


    hahaha! Bynum has a higher rank than Charlie V?? Who in the world are rating these players?! How many points and turnovers did Bynum average again last season?

    • Sep 16, 20119:24 am
      by tarsier


      Gotta love how you are the only commenter who thinks that is a mistake.

  • Sep 15, 201111:20 pm
    by neutes


    It’s kind of cool to see how the outside world feels about the Pistons players. 

    Not sure how either of you two graded them (maybe you should reveal that at the end), but if I had to rate the Pistons players I’d go:

    Macklin: 0
    Summers: 0
    White: 0
    Singler: 1
    Maxiell: 1
    Villanueva: 2
    Knight: 2
    Gordon: 3
    Wallace: 3
    Bynum: 4
    Wilcox: 4
    Daye: 4
    Rip: 4
    Mcgrady: 4
    Jerebko: 4
    Prince: 5
    Stuckey: 5
    Monroe: 7

    Also the order I’d have them ranked in a top 500.

    • Sep 16, 20118:58 am
      by Patrick Hayes


      To be honest, I probably wouldn’t be able to remember the exact score I gave every player. There were so many voters ESPN used, that it was just a poll that went out so to my knowledge, the individual votes aren’t saved anywhere. But I think my order/scores were nearly the same as yours except I think I had Jerebko and McGrady in the 5 range if I remember correctly.

  • Sep 16, 201112:32 pm
    by RyanK


    Everytime I see CV putting on that stupid headband and walking over to the scorer’s table I want to throw up.  Putting the ball in his hands is like throwing it into a blackhole.  If he’s not hitting the three ball, what value is he?  He doesn’t defend, he doesn’t rebound, and he doesn’t pass.  The man is almost 7 feet tall and he plays like he’s 6-6 taking perimeter shots.
    Maybe we can talk the T-wolves into taking CV.  Kahn has a reputation for stupid moves.

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